AFC and NFC Championship Recap
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On this episode of Missing the Point: we break down the AFC and NFC Championship games from this past weekend, with Tom Brady advancing to his 10th Super Bowl appearances in his career as the Tampa Bay Buccaneers defeat Aaron Rodgers and the Green Bay Packers.
We'll also break down the AFC Championship as Patrick Mahomes and the Kansas City Chiefs move on to their second straight Super Bowl after defeating the Buffalo Bills.
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This episode of missing the point is being brought to you by box Oh crafts, save 15% off your first holiday box at checkout with the promo code MTP. That's box o crafts.com. On this episode of missing the point, we break down the AFC and NFC Championship games from this past weekend, with Tom Brady advancing to his 10th Super Bowl appearances career as the Tampa Bay Buccaneers to feed Aaron Rodgers and the Green Bay Packers. We'll also break down the AFC Championship as Patrick mahomes and the Kansas City Chiefs move on to their second straight Super Bowl after defeating the Buffalo Bills. But first some housekeeping. Missing important is a one hour podcast recapping the biggest stories in the world of sports with the New England flavour. The show notes and transcript of today's episode can be found in the description box below, as well as on our website. www dot MTP show.com. If you're new to the show, consider subscribing. It's the easiest way to see when we publish new episodes. We are on Apple podcasts, Spotify, Google and wherever you get your podcast. If you're listening on Apple podcasts, make sure to rate the show and leave a review for a chance to win a free missing the point t shirt. Be sure to follow us on all of our social medias. All of our links will be in the show notes and check out our brand new website WWW dot MTV show.com that's MTP show.com. And now this is missing the point Episode 36. But it's all relative.
Joe Malkin:Welcome into missing the point I'm your host Joe Malkin. And joining me today the man who is most known in his life for leading horses to water and making them drink without actually drinking the water himself. It's Mike Mark Angelo. And I also have the man who no one will leave alone about the Conor McGregor fight but me until now, DK sisal Dave Clark and of course we have the best EP that we could find on the street, Craig D'Alessandro, it's a good thing. We've all known him for so long, or he probably wouldn't be doing this because we know he doesn't like any of us. Guys, we have a lot to talk about tonight. And it's mostly football. Why? Because the AFC and NFC championships were this past Sunday, and the Superbowl is in less than two weeks. So let's get right into it. And let's talk about the NFC Championship game between the Buccaneers and the Packers, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers who are in the playoffs for the first time since 2007. Beat the Packers 31 to 26. And the first question I want to ask and I'm gonna ask it to Mike is to the Packers ever have control of this game. They couldn't score off turnovers seven points off of three interceptions and 67 total rushing yards. But statistically across the board, their numbers could be where arguably better than Tampa's What say you?
Michael Marcangelo:Well, I say that Green Bay never control this game. This This game was always controlled by Tom Brady and the Buccaneer defense, most of the Buccaneer defense just so we don't start another discord or undiscovered war here. But in reality, it was what 2110 going into halftime. So I think the Buccaneers just had a very good plan on how to beat Green Bay, they did it already earlier this year. Right? It was 38 to 10. I think had the Buccaneers played as well as they did in that game, this game on offense and defense, it would have been a blowout. But for me. Yeah, I just, I mean, you guys all know, I don't have any faith in Aaron Rodgers,
Dave Clarke:I actually predicted he was gonna go six to 10 this year. So I literally will never bet on him. I will bet on him to lose. And that's exactly what he did in mind. He but he did though, like the thing is, as much as we beat you with that stick of that bad Packers prediction for the entire season. And as much as he had a great statistical year, you did stick to your guns on the idea that Aaron Rodgers isn't a winner. And what was nice is that he created essentially a meme for us of him not rushing the ball when he had all that open field and like trying to force a throw. That proved your point. Exactly. And I going into my predictions were so bad over the weekend, as Joe pointed out, considering the Conor McGregor fight was didn't go the way I wanted it to. So I actually intentionally picked the Packers, because I've been I've had such bad picks for the entirety of the playoffs. I was like, Oh, let me just try to jinx reverse Jinx or Jinx the Packers. But I didn't need to because you are totally right. Aaron Rodgers is equal in NFC Championship games with Tom Brady now and Tom Brady just got to the party. Yeah, he's just not that dude. And you were 100%. right about that? Yeah, you maybe not the regular season record, but like at least she had that.
Joe Malkin:But so on the topic of Brady and Rogers, who had a better day, granted Tom Brady, one who had a better day.
Dave Clarke:I'll tell you who had a better day. Tom Brady did but he shouldn't have. Because the entire narrative now which part of it's fair because like, Look, he is the greatest quarterback of all time, he's gone to all these Super Bowls, he's won the most. It's that's all great, but that the narrative immediately became that on every social media platform and every television show about the NFC Championship game, but he almost blew the game, if anybody was gonna throw the game, he was it was gonna be him, they were cruising coming into the second half. And he threw two bad picks sandwich on either side of an Aaron Rodgers touchdown drive when he was starting to get some momentum. And I think if it wasn't, if it was anybody else, if it was like a younger, Ben Roethlisberger, or if it was if he had to play like that, even against Drew Brees, or I'll tell you, it's gonna happen against Patrick mahomes. If he tries to pull that shit, then he gets punished for it. He got real, real lucky that his defense was able to bail him out. And I think he had the better day because he had like a nice day, because he won the game and like people were being really nice to him afterwards. But I think if anybody was like he had a statistically worse day than Aaron Rodgers. So in the Tom Brady versus Aaron Rodgers debate, he loses that but he still won the game and he gets all the credit for it cuz he's fuckin Tom Brady. So like, Good for him. I guess.
Michael Marcangelo:For me, I think statistically, Aaron Rodgers had a better game. But in reality, Tom Brady actually had a better game. And there are a couple of reasons why I'm gonna say that. Okay, so he did throw three terrible interceptions in the second half. Right, that happened. But what's always just kind of not talked about is they were up 28 to 10 at that point, so worst case scenario, all those turn into points and they're down by three. Right so it wouldn't have been it would not have been a huge momentum swing
Unknown:momentum. So important in football, though,
Michael Marcangelo:not in the plan. Not what not what Aaron Rodgers is your quarterback, dude. Yeah, you
Dave Clarke:can see that in retrospect. But what When was the last time he came back from it from a deficit in a playoff game? He can't do it. Any other quarterback would have been absolutely pasted for trying to give the game away like that in the second half. And he wasn't because he said I'm ready.
Michael Marcangelo:And the second reason why I think that he had a better game is what you brought up before Davis because Okay, so we just think about this, right? There was what there was three seconds left in the half, and Brady takes his shot for a touchdown. Absolutely dying. In a perfect ball. Aaron Rodgers, who's known pretty well for his mobility, has 39 on the nine yard line and a wide open field in front of him and did not put the game in his hands. So for me, I think Yeah, statistically, Brady, was inferior to Rogers. But at the end of the day, when it mattered, when it really was not cutting time, Brady wanted the ball and he made all the decisions that he needed to make. And I'd rather I think, for any I think all of us here, we'd rather lose with a quarterback with the ball in his hand, do what he thought was right, to win the game as opposed to just doing what what whatever the whatever the play call was,
Dave Clarke:at the gate, like if you're betting odds on the game, before you go in it, you can make an argument for Benton Packers vs. bucks. But if somebody had told you, we're actually you're actually betting on who's going to deliver in the big moments if you hadn't thought about it like that. You bet. Tom Brady 100% of the time. Yeah, you're 100% right. Like, you can No, that wasn't Tom Brady's only big moment like he started off the game with a couple of really nice drives too. And like, I think that you're right, Aaron Rodgers is the worst of the quarterback to be put in a situation where he gets punched in the mouth early. I think that I think that they did that to him. And it wasn't him it like you said it. He doesn't come back in games like that. He's not that dog. He it wasn't him coming back. I was my point. It was tougher. He's trying to throw the game away. So like, everyone's given the Buccaneers defense. The credit, though. You know what I mean? Like, I think that's fair enough to like, Aaron Rodgers isn't that dude, that's gonna crawl back. But that box defense is like hard to score on to
Michael Marcangelo:if Brady throws his three picks when it's 1010. He didn't do that. But he threw them after he had an 18 point lead. So it's a little bit different. They were bad throws.
Dave Clarke:I mean, statline look like at jameis Winston statline ironically. So it's like like three and three. Yeah, so it's like oh, couldn't they just done this? James is like no, so I see what you're saying. The intangibles matter. Like the moments the Tom Brady moments of course they matter because you can sit there and talk about stats all day. When you watch the game you realize that Tom Brady's their quarterback, and there's a reason why they go into the Super Bowl. I think there's another quarterback that's going to be the reason why they don't win it though. So we'll get to that.
Joe Malkin:We can get to that on Sunday in the live show, which will be our two hour preview show of the Super Bowl so we can plug that right now. So on Facebook, live on Facebook Live will be on our Facebook page missing the points is the name of the Facebook page. It will be on there for a two hour a Superbowl preview show which is going to be an absolute blast. So
Dave Clarke:I only want to talk about the halftime show. Is that okay?
Joe Malkin:Yeah, we can do that. What I was gonna say was Mike if Jimmy McGinty was his head coach Aaron Rodgers definitely would have run that ball and there's like the fourth replacements joke of the day. One of my big things and Dave, you kind of alluded to it. One of my big things that leads to my feelings towards Tom Brady in his career and how he's treated like Dave said any other quarterback would be ripped for that line. But because it's Tom Brady, that's part of the problem that I have is that with how he's been treated is that he can do no wrong. There have been so many times sitting in the stands. Tom Brady will overthrow a receiver by 10 yards. It's six feet above the receivers head, and it's out of bounds and people in the stands are calling for the receivers head and wondering why he didn't catch it. This is one of the biggest things I problems I have with the Tom Brady isms and the Brady fans of the world. But to throw my two cents in, Tom Brady definitely had the better day because of how the game went. And Mike The moment he threw that pass to Scottie Miller in the end zone with eight seconds left on the clock in the second quarter. And they flash over to Ryan suck up, right, the Buccaneers kicker. And you can kind of see it on this face, like wow, I'm not gonna get an opportunity here. And then Brady drops a dime. So that's one of those differences. And that's where that quote that Bruce Arians said, which I still think he's overrated and not I know, I like Bruce Arians, I just the quote is just really absolutely asinine that you said is
Dave Clarke:like, I just sit on the sidelines and watch him or
Joe Malkin:Yeah, sometimes I just sit on the sidelines and watch him and like the Patriots didn't give them that freedom. It's like screw you guy. Like you're the coach, Coach the game if you want. I don't know, I understand why you
Dave Clarke:do the job right now. It's just like, stick the burden on the Patriots every now and again, and just be like, hey, look, I did it with him to anybody can I'm presenting a fucking idiot. If I can do it, anyone can do it.
Joe Malkin:sure he's doing what every coach that has coached. LeBron James maybe with the exception of Erik Spoelstra has been told to do stand back and let it happen. And that's fine.
Dave Clarke:I would say suppose straight not to get into that. Actually, let's not get into that.
Joe Malkin:But I will say this Spoelstra is a better coach of basketball than Bruce Arians is a coach in football.
Dave Clarke:Now, when the Brown was there, though, he was the quintessential stand back and watch him do shit because he nobody thought he was any good then but he's all right now I guess just because he beat the Celtics we saw started blowing him but like he's okay. He's funnier.
Michael Marcangelo:To your point, though, Joe. Like when you say like everyone can act like Tom Brady can do no wrong. And I think that's I think it's over exaggerated. I think that there are people out there that do that. But it's because historically, in a situation where you can't if he does something wrong, you will lose the game. He doesn't do anything wrong. He always makes the overwhelmingly the majority of the time he makes the right decision. And when it matters, so that affords him the right to do it. He puts
Joe Malkin:himself in the position to make the correct decisions. And you're absolutely right. He's been around long enough. He knows what he's supposed to do. He's the greatest of all time, no one will take that away from him. And in two weeks, if he wins, there's no conversation in any sport of any athlete at this time. And you and I both said that. I don't think Dave was part of that conversation. Before you go on. I
Michael Marcangelo:just have one. Can we can we just talk about that. 39. Just real quick. Is there any doubt in your mind? Like we all know that Brady can't run, right? If he has that wide open of a field? No, Brady can't run that.
Dave Clarke:The reason why we're talking about is because it's Aaron Rodgers. Right. And Rodgers could make that play. Have you seen as Tom Brady is noticeably slow when he's running back towards his running back to hand the ball off. He's the slowest man. He's like fucking molasses out there. You're crazy.
Michael Marcangelo:I watched him break or like his ankles. I mean, he can do it. All right. First of all, let's
Dave Clarke:if you really want to get into that, first of all, that was like 1000 years ago. Okay. And like he wasn't super fast. Then second off, I'm not talking about juking speed or side to side movement. I'm talking about running 10 yards he would have liked somebody would have ended his career if he tried to do that in that situation three. I'm pretty sure Brian Urlacher was too easy on him because he didn't want to kill Tom Brady. And Tom Brady was kind of being kind of a dick about it and through fake but like whatever. All good. Yep, that happened. Thanks for bringing it up.
Joe Malkin:Yeah, bring bring that up. Mike kick a guy while he's down. Oh, shoot. So I want to switch sides of the ball for the bucks and talk about the Bucs defense because they had one of their best defensive players, rookie Antoine Winfield Jr. out. They had a lot of injuries. They had a lot of issues, five sacks and an interception of Aaron Rodgers in this game. And a part of the conversation with the Buccaneers, especially the second half of the season was that they hadn't put it together yet. And the scary thing is and I agree with Dave about the Super Bowl, but the scary thing is they're clicking and they're firing on all cylinders. And if they get Anton Winfield back like what can this what is this defense capable of not in terms of a Superbowl but just in terms of what we saw Sunday?
Michael Marcangelo:Well, I think that they're I mean, they were top five or top 10 defense last year, right. So that carried over, they have all the right pieces on the on that defensive side of the ball. It's just a matter of knowing when to pick your spots. And I think Todd Bowles does a really good job, for the most part and has for the last six weeks of the season, including the playoffs of understanding who he's playing. Like with Aaron Rodgers there, there weren't that many blitzes. Like if you really watched that he would they were getting pressure with fort with Forman blitzes, which is literally nothing. So if they stick to that if they don't try really to jack the line up with eight people on the line, and go after Gloucester mahomes, I think they have a shot. We saw what they did earlier in this year. I mean, when they only lost by three points, 2724. And we'll preview that. But I think that both that this defense has enough playmakers on it to do what they need to do to give their offense a chance to win the game.
Dave Clarke:Do you think that or do you hope that
Michael Marcangelo:based on what I saw when they played this year, I've seen it?
Dave Clarke:I mean, I just I feel like the Chiefs also have gotten kind of back to their old selves a little bit.
Michael Marcangelo:tyreke Hill had 200 yards receiving in the first half. And I came and only one by three.
Dave Clarke:Yeah, no, but like, there's still one. That's fine. I don't know. I mean, I just looked at that chiefs offense in the AFC Championship game. I know we're not onto that yet. But that just didn't seem any. Like anyone can stop them to me. I mean, I know the Bucs defense is good. But I don't know if they're stop that offense get especially with how Super Bowls tend to go. It's like it's usually about the offense.
Joe Malkin:Usually, but a lot of that's going to come down to coaching and game planning. But again, we'll get to that because I think there is an intangible there that the Buccaneers don't have time to
Michael Marcangelo:walk this line. Dude, it's really hard to talk about this not talking about the next game, but we're gonna try and do it. I know we're doing our best. So
Joe Malkin:let's talk about another part of this game, Mike. And another another interesting decision, Bobby and I talked about this in the discord for probably 45 minutes. Pretty simple conversation, honestly, but because there was no right or wrong answer with this one. And let's just play that out. I mean, in my mind, there's no right or wrong answer here. I thought it was a lose. But they kick a field goal on fourth and goal from the eight instead of going for the touchdown with three minutes left in the fourth quarter. Had they scored and gotten the two point cover? Had they not they would have been down by eight giving Tom Brady the ball back at the 15 yard line and at his own 15 yard line. And had they made the field goal, which they did. Now they're down by five, with three timeouts also giving the ball back to Tom Brady. So what's your take on this diff?
Dave Clarke:How many interceptions have they gotten by that point? It didn't seem bad to me at the time when I was watching it. I in retrospect when you like break out the math, I agree that it sounds bad. But if you remember when you're watching the Steelers game and he didn't go for it on like fourth and one time he didn't go for like fourth and one and you knew at the time like the eye test. You were like, that was such a fuckup like he needed to go right if you can't get a yard that whole thing. At the time. I was like, there's a lot of time left on the clock. Like they picked Brady off. I think they picked them off. At least twice. Yeah, it was it three times at that point. Okay, so he they picked him up three times. And they were like, okay, we can stop these guys. Like, let's not take any dumb risks and like give them Let's trust the defense is how it felt to me at the time. But I do see coming back. It's like it didn't work out. But hindsight hindsight is 2020 thing for me in that situation. I don't blame them for that. I blame them for fucking up a bunch of other things, if not that specifically.
Michael Marcangelo:So I mean, I understand what you're saying. But I completely disagree. Listen, when you have Aaron Rodgers as your company back, right, that's right. But why is that I completely understand. That's the new part. It throws for 4300 yards, 48 touchdowns, and in this game, he was he had three touchdowns in one pack. And you're telling me that you don't trust that guy with davante Adams with all the weapons that they have there to get eight yards, just give them one more shot.
Dave Clarke:I would rather trust that guy. You started off the show. So I'm not but
Michael Marcangelo:I'm not a coach, not as coach. I have no faith in him. And what this just showed me is that the floor had no faith in him either.
Dave Clarke:I don't think so. I think they just trust in their defense you trust that you can trust your defense and not automatically not trust your quarterback.
Michael Marcangelo:I also think it's more of this stat crap, right is that though all those stat nerves on the sidelines saying well, you have a pretty good opportunity here to kick a field goal and get the ball back and drive down the field.
Joe Malkin:Well, but that has to play into it. That stuff has to play into it. But let's not go into baseball real quick. I had to throw this in there because we have to talk about the scenarios right? So if they miss on fourth and eight, they give Tom Brady the ball at the eight sure they can stop them but it's still giving the ball back to the greatest quarterback of all time with an eight point lead at the eight yard line. All he has to do is run the clock out even though they have three timeouts. Okay, or they get the touchdown miss the two point conversion They're still down by two still need the ball back, you're still putting the ball in the hands of the greatest quarterback of all time. With time on the clock, they can get the touchdown, get the two point conversion. Now it's a tie ballgame, you're still giving the ball back to the best quarterback of all time. And all he has to do is giving Ryan succumbs range to take the lead and win the ballgame. Or you kick the field goal, you get you kick the field goal, you're down by five, you're still putting the ball into the hands of the greatest quarterback of all time. So either way, you have to stop them.
Michael Marcangelo:No, that's not true that what you all the scenarios that you just mentioned are true. But the one that you fail to mention is what if something goes wrong, and they have a safety on Tom Brady, and then they get the ball back? Right. So then the Packers, they get a safety on Tom Brady, they get two points and then green are then Tampa Bay has to kick to Green Bay. So that is another scenario. I don't know that would have happened. But all I know, is two things. If you don't trust your guy, to get eight yards and get a touchdown, there's a problem. If you don't trust your defense, to bait Tom Brady, who had already thrown three interceptions in that game into saying, oh, they're gonna Blitz me, let's do something here in the eight yard line and pick them off. Again, we have a problem. There is no trust in anything besides that
Dave Clarke:the special teams in my opinion, I don't know if it's a trust thing. I feel like the Packers have like no time of possession either. Like that was part of the Bucs game plan. Like they came out and they had the ball for so long every time they scored. And a lot of that was because they were able to establish their running game and like, they have weapons, they're all that stuff. But it's gonna get into your head a little bit. No matter who you are, if you've barely had the ball and you're asking your offense to make the biggest play of the game. I just think that's gonna factor into it. It's just another factor as opposed to just like they blew it. They didn't take the risk. Like you can say that in hindsight. And I've somehow you've backed me into sticking up for the fucking Green Bay Packers. So I hate but I just think it's like, I don't know, I like you said at the start of the show. It's like Tom Brady. I mean, the Buccaneers defenses, there's a lot of credit. And they've been making plays, like especially the first quarter, they stuffed them so many times, like so many momentum killers in the first quarter, you're staring down the barrel of that it's just not the same as if like you've made plays already. You've already made some plays and you can get those yards. That wasn't the case, they were asking them to their offense to do something that they hadn't really done up until that point in that game, maybe in the playoffs and stuff like that, but they hadn't really like gotten it going like that, but their defense was kind of rolling. So it's like Alright, let's just the D but situation I get what you're saying. But
Michael Marcangelo:I also think not to argue with myself and to back Dave up in the in the process. I think the coach saw what Aaron Rodgers did on 39 and said, Well, he's just I mean, if it's not they're
Dave Clarke:not gonna do it. You know, that's a it's a very john madden piece of commentary but to say like, if you could make those nine yards you wouldn't be on fourth down the fucking first place. But and which is sort of obvious, but it's true. It's like if you hadn't made that play, you shouldn't be in that situation. The first place that adds to it I
Joe Malkin:agree with you totally. Should have been different plays throughout the game that got them
Dave Clarke:39 is it bigger is more egregious that they're not going forward on fourth, I guess is my overall point. Mike, I
Joe Malkin:mean, it I, my final point on this topic was it would be if they don't kick that field goal. And they go for it on fourth and gold from the eight and they don't get it. I came over at that point. That game is over to me like to do. Again, you're giving the ball back to Tom Brady. And that Buccaneer team who had played very well, that defense who had sacked Aaron Rodgers five times, they picked them off once at that point already. It was definitely against the floors, usual style. But I'm with Dave I think it just so many things changed throughout the game. That that was what what the call warranted for at the time. For me
Michael Marcangelo:you have a first ballot Hall of Famer as your quarterback, he's a $30 million cap hit for the next three years. He's had one of his had a resurgence season one of the best seasons of his career. That's a hill you die on. I'm okay as the coach losing the game on fourth and eight with the ball and Aaron Rodgers hands because that's that because when you
Dave Clarke:put it like that, but it's still Aaron Rodgers is the guy with all those accolades he just meant mentioned and you even said at the start of the show that he's not that
Unknown:the coach knows that he's you know that he shouldn't be the coach. He shouldn't be the coach. You got to try it How can both things
Dave Clarke:be true? Like is he not that guy and like that's your honest assessment of Aaron Rodgers and that means that's right in your head that was that guy so he's doing the right thing by not trust I
Michael Marcangelo:could not coach Aaron Rodgers because I believe him to be a glorified elite
Dave Clarke:choker. Like I just don't think he has meant I think that we've seen that
Michael Marcangelo:price. If you are the coach of Aaron Rodgers, you can't believe that because you're going to you're not going to put like it's just not gonna work. So I guess
Dave Clarke:so. He's damned if he doesn't Dan. If he doesn't, then Mike, because if he hasn't, if he trusts Aaron Rodgers and what you say about him is true. He might have done the right thing as a coach, but he's still gonna lose the fucking game.
Unknown:Just Just give it up. Rogers a chance to prove me wrong. That's what I'm having.
Dave Clarke:Well, he didn't but I don't think it's a coach's fault that's the that's Aaron Rodgers not taking responsibility you know what I mean? Like he's out on the field the ball in his hands This is pre play call when he doesn't make that third and I'm, you know what I do love about this game though and I didn't I should have put it into perspective before the game started. It's the Aaron Rodgers versus Tom Brady is a matchup I didn't know I needed in my life. And like in a conference championship game, especially because do you guys remember maybe you didn't get this media because you're like on the east coast and stuff. But do you guys remember before the season offseason before Brady won his sixth? Super Bowl, not like raffle. But the season before that there was this weird thing going around where everyone was like, is Aaron Rodgers actually the goat like because yeah, he maybe hasn't. I know the answer is no, I think you're shaking his head at me. I'm like, No, no, I didn't invent this story. It was like pre Brady six. He was like, Yeah, but he's like more talented on paper, right? There was like this weird kind of narrative. And I was like, no, it's like five to one like, No, you can't and that was always my opinion on it. And like not being a Patriots fan and hating the Packers. That was like an easy and easy get for me. Then he goes in win six. And I'm like, okay, no one can talk about Aaron Rodgers anymore. But I realized people still were so it's really nice for me to have this game to point to to say like, Oh, no, he couldn't even shine his fucking cleats. Dude, it's not even close look at that NFC Championship game from 2021 when Brady's probably pissing in a bag on his ankle, because he's about 1001 years old. And Aaron Rodgers just had a career year and got waxed. Like, what a lovely thing to have happened. It's like really cheered me up to put context on it.
Joe Malkin:So moving on to what happened after that field. So what happened after that field goal, and it looked like on the first couple plays, or the next Plex drive, like they were gonna get stopped, right. And then the Packers get called for a pie in the middle of the field. And at first, I thought it was a soccer flop. I thought the receiver had just absolutely gone down hadn't been touched. And then at second glance, well, the defensive back was literally pulling his undershirt off of him. I think it should have been a hold over a pie five yards in first down instead of 20 yards in the first down. Doesn't really matter. Right. But at that point, that's pretty much what sealed it.
Michael Marcangelo:Yeah, I mean, for me, like, that's just bad coaching dude. Right? Like, again, and not cutting time. Like there, there have been a couple plays in that game where Tampa I believe got away with a couple. Right, so maybe they were thinking that they weren't calling them as in, it's the last couple plays in the game. You can't turn a size medium shirt into a three X, they're gonna call it, they called it on that play. I mean, the replay when we first saw it, I'm with you, Joe, I was like, that's a late flag. Like you don't want to win that way. You see the replay, and the guy is stretching the guy should across the entire screen. You can't do that. It's bad coaching. Again, they weren't that entire team for me, the Packers does not know how to handle the big moment. And it was just illustrated again and again. And again.
Dave Clarke:You can't turn around and just blame Mike McCarthy now to like, like you did last year. There's a whole narrative around it. I will say though, and I'm not I don't disagree with you. It was definitely a pass interference. And it was definitely a bonehead decision. It's tough in a moment when you get beat, like by step, especially in big moments like that to not react and like do some silly, but I will say they were not calling that for the majority of that game. I saw a few of those. Like I saw a few like they were lightning play. And like I agree with you that it's a pass interference. I agree with you that it was the most blatant. So it's like you're over the line instead of toeing the line. I just form it with refereeing. I just asked for consistency. That's my main request. And I just didn't feel it in that game. And I thought it was I thought we lowered down a little bit there. But yeah, it was the right call.
Michael Marcangelo:I think it brings us back to everything that we've always kind of talked about on the show that was like don't put yourself in a position for the referee to decide. Yeah, and that guy did it.
Dave Clarke:Yeah. I mean, it happened to have the same thing happened with the bears, right like they are we blow ourselves up by getting dejected and making dumb decisions. And it's like, you can cry about the refs all you want. You're absolutely right. You can cry about the wrestling one, but like don't let them get involved. It's not basketball, in basketball, they're involved from the gate from the jump, there's nothing you can do. There's no way to not have them be involved. But in football, you can take them out of the game if you're playing the right way. And you're totally right about that.
Joe Malkin:One thing that they're not talking about much and probably because it's completely irrelevant, is the fact that if he hadn't held him or interfered that balls probably over his head that was not a very well throwing pass. I wish
Dave Clarke:there was a way to know that like, I know there isn't but wouldn't it be great if there was a way with science to know if it was like like that Christian McCaffrey commercial where it's like him being annoying, and then it's like 26% chance to like jump this guy and get it into the end zone. Is that real? Because like, I want someone to run that computer program if the balls uncatchable just do the thing with the Christian what's that even for? I don't even know. But um, but here's,
Joe Malkin:so here's what you should do. It's the Amazon. It's the end. On thing, so yeah, what I think you should do being in LA is fine, Jeff Bezos and get in touch with Dean blandino for another show. And the three of you, since you're in your line of work, and those two are doing the things they do, get in touch with them, and you can figure it up,
Dave Clarke:dude, I know think it sounds like they already have the technology unless that commercials lying to me about Christian McCaffrey being like three guys, I got 14% even though like, No, those guys are anywhere near them. And that's in that in that shot, whatever. I personally, did they shoot film that I don't know. But if that technology works, apply it and they have no pass interference calls that ruin games anymore, because it's like, oh, we're just gonna run the Christian McCaffrey commercial program. And then it's just like 0% probability catching, it's like, sorry, guys, the computer says no, and then you just move on with your day,
Joe Malkin:or the game you did it for. They did it for a deshaun Watson commercial too. I wonder if they knew the percentage chance that he would be back in here.
Dave Clarke:I want to know that technology exists because it can really improve the game of football.
Joe Malkin:It really could. It really could. And honestly, I want to see it. And I'd love for you to be a part of that. So this is where we'll talk about the Super Bowl, but we'll talk about it. We'll talk about it in the context of Tom Brady and the Super Bowl as a whole. We'll throw a million incredible stats and numbers at you on Sunday in our live show on Facebook Live. missing the points on Facebook. We'll be there from six to 8pm on Sunday, January 31, to break down the entire Super Bowl and preview that whole game. But here's one that will give you Tom Brady is nine and three all time against NFC teams in the playoffs six and three in Super Bowls three and oh, this postseason. He has one less win against NFC teams in the playoffs than Aaron Rodgers, who obviously has 10 and he has the same amount of NFC Championship games as Aaron Rodgers and Drew Brees. And as Dave said, he just got to the party. Better late than never. Here's the question. Is there any other quarterback not named Pat mahomes that could bring a team to Super Bowl in year one of being there.
Michael Marcangelo:So the reason why I love this question is well, one I wrote it to give that away. Sorry, sorry, but it I was thinking I was because the Buccaneers last year were seven to nine, right? six or nine losses work by seven points or less. So it's like, okay, they're kinda there. Brady brought the Brady brought the Buccaneers to four, come from behind wins this year of more than 10 points. So I'm thinking to myself, is there any other guy that could do that? Montana couldn't bring the Chiefs there? Right. And he was the great Oh,
Dave Clarke:we're doing all the time.
Michael Marcangelo:Well, what but then I'm like, Okay, well, could Eric like, what if Aaron Rodgers was on this team? This is what I was thinking. And I just kept thinking to myself, he couldn't do it. Like he. I don't think there's another quarterback currently playing in the NFL. That will might I think there's one sorry. I think Ben could go down there and do it.
Dave Clarke:Ben Roethlisberger.
Michael Marcangelo:I think I think Roethlisberger because all he does is stand back there, throw the ball 40 yards he loves. I mean, that's a Bruce Arians offense.
Dave Clarke:But he wouldn't be the guy I would pick if I had to pick any other. If the context of the question, if I understand it correctly, is Tom Brady Wentz. It's got traded to Tampa Bay and brought me to a Super Bowl if anyone else got traded in Tampa Bay, would they be able to do it? So the question within the question is, was that team so good? They just needed somebody at quarterback? Or was it because it was Tom Brady? And I think like, I think if you put a lot of quarterbacks in that team, personally, I think they could have done this. I think the defense like we talked about is good. I think if deshaun Watson is in that quarterback role, I think they're electric and they probably have a better chance to win the Super Bowl next week. To be honest with you.
Michael Marcangelo:I I think skill set wise, you're right. But football acumen i think is where we're losing here right is because Brady's been in the league for 20 years, he's seen all the things that work don't work and for better or for worse, if we take ariens at his word areas isn't telling Brady what to do 100% of the time, he's leaving, he's deferring to him. So are there any other quarterbacks in the league that are afforded that right to do it and have the same results? I don't think so. I really don't I think yeah, I think Shawn Watson has more talent than Tom Brady in terms of mobility and accurate and and just arm strength. But I don't know if ariens leaves it to him to do it. And to coach the game on the field. Yeah, I
Dave Clarke:see your point. That's a good that's a good point. I mean, maybe like you so in that class of people, Drew Brees maybe I would take drew over Aaron. For all the reasons we outlined about Aaron Rodgers but I would take drew over Aaron even though he didn't look at all like the same guy this year. I do think that the way that that would that amount of weapons to just be able because like when Kamara and stuff was going off for him like he didn't have five of him. He just had him really and like a couple other guys can make plays if you're throwing it to that many people. But then if it's not Brady that they get a B in there, you know what I mean? Like
Joe Malkin:Darren koski probably whenever
Dave Clarke:he's not there so like a lot of their workforce down to Tom to like, would they even come and play for that team because there's a lot of people came there to play with Tom Brady. That was like the whole point. Nobody cared the whole every meme that's like trying to shit on New England right now is like nobody came to play in England after Brady left. They're all there for Brady. So yeah, I think that's part of it too. Right. Not just the Bruce Arians thing,
Michael Marcangelo:but you think, I think Aaron Rodgers has that club, maybe not gronk. Right, because gronk is Brady's boy. But if Aaron Rodgers tells the front office of of Tampa to sign Antonio Brown, they do it. I think they did. But he
Dave Clarke:wouldn't do that, though, because he didn't play on them in New England. You know what I mean? Like they didn't try them out. And I'm like, Yeah, the way that your question was phrased To me, it's like, oh, yeah, no, like all the things that Tom Brady brings to the table, which, including specifically Rob gronkowski, came back and made a bunch of plays. And like to me, I might have said this on record many times. It didn't make sense to me that Rob gronkowski was going to Tampa to play because I thought he was cooked because in my head if Brady are sorry if Belichick wanted Brady, and gronk, he could have had him, you know what I mean? Like he could have had them that year before all that stuff got weird. So that tells me that combo doesn't work anymore. And now it's not the same as when like gronkowski was running through 50 people, and like just sacrificing his hips and his knees to that for the cause. But it was still a great, it's still a great tandem that like helped them get to a Super Bowl. So yeah, all the things Tom Brady brings to the table to the table really, definitely helped. And also the context to have jamis being the guy who was there was like just not Tom Brady and like him leaving and it being about efficiency, like what we're really lacking with jameis Winston is as much as he can be dynamic at times. we're lacking efficiency. And we need a kid like a field General, a guy that can just like get us through games with efficiency and don't blow games for us. And even though he had a jameis Winston style in the NFC Championship game. I think that's another thing that Tom Brady specifically brought to that team. Yeah, I
Joe Malkin:agree with you, I guess is the long way of saying that. So while we need to move on to the AFC Championship game since we've spent 30 minutes on Tom Brady in the NFC Championship game. The one thing I will say that has that this is all proven to me with this Buccaneer team last year this run through the playoffs is I am, it is now solidified in my mind that Josh McDaniels is a fraud. We can talk about that more on Sunday. But I and I don't want to make this into Biron left, which is a fraud, because I don't think he is because he hasn't been necessarily in an OC role for long enough to have that title put on him, I think by and large, which is up and coming and I think Tom Brady being his quarterback is great for Byron Leftwich, right. But I think because of how this is going, and we're seeing them play. So similarly to how we saw New England play for so many years, minus the long balls that Tom Brady's actually throwing this year is that it was Tom and Josh McDaniels is a fraud. So moving on to the AFC Championship because I'm not even going to let you guys get into that we'll get we'll touch back on now on Sunday. Kansas City Chiefs beat the Buffalo Bills 38 to 24. Guys, this one got chippy at the end. And it was a really honestly, this was both of these games were a lot of fun to watch. But this one was a lot of fun to watch. And I think it's because the chiefs are a lot of fun to watch. Mike, are the Chiefs on track? And are they better than they were in? 2019?
Michael Marcangelo:Yeah, I mean, I don't, I think they're on the right track. I don't know if they're better than they were last year. It looks like they're pretty equal. The one thing about this game is like, if I were to tell you that the bills would score the first nine points. And the last nine points of the game, you think, okay, that's pretty good. The Chiefs went on the 38 to six run in between those in between that period of time, like whenever they want to turn it on, they can turn it on. So I think that I think this team is I think mahomes 29 to 38 3025. three touchdowns. There's just there's no one currently more talented in the league at the quarterback position than Patrick mahomes. So I think as long as he's healthy like they This is their new normal.
Joe Malkin:Dave, you talk about the there. You mentioned them earlier. And so we we get back to it when we get to the AFC Championship game. And you just think they're so dynamic and can't be stopped. Mike just gave you Patrick mahomes numbers. They had 114 total rushing yards 50 of which were by a wide receiver and they had two receivers well, Titan and a receiver. Guess who tyreke Hill and Travis Kelsey over 100 yards. Travis Kelsey had nine catches in the first half. Talk about this the dynamics of this Kansas City team because I'm with you in total agreement? Yeah. I
Dave Clarke:mean, if the question is, are they as good as last year, they're still doing that same thing where it was like nine to three or whatever. And I swear to God, I looked down at my phone, I look back up and it was like nine to 18. I was like, Wait a second. What happened? And I think that's what they do. There's the scores so quickly, and they can score on you. Like you said at will. And we talked, we talked extensively about Aaron Rodgers like running to make that play. If it's like 39 Patrick mahomes, you're not even talking about that play. If it's Patrick mahomes, it's not gonna come up like it the way. It's also everybody around him, like you said, I mean, there's so many dynamic players their sideline to sideline in the first 10 yards away from the line of scrimmage, they can dump the ball and get 30 yards, not just like 10 like they can dump the ball to somebody and get like 30 to 50 yards like that. And it's just like, how it's just like, it's not a new way to play football like short slants and stuff like that and dynamic movement behind the line of scrimmage beforehand and and making man coverage like, Oh, you know, you can't take him one on one. You can't take him one on one. They have so many of those guys. But for some reason, the way that they can get momentum going him you immediately decide they're going to win the game once they start to do that. And like, like you said, the sandwich, start the game with the first nine and the game of the first night doesn't matter. They lift you up for 36 in the middle and they know that they can do that. There's like a whole confidence factor. I was watching some of the sideline stuff. Who was the guy who came off the punt. Was that hill that month the punt.
Michael Marcangelo:Hardman
Dave Clarke:we call Harmon Yeah. And then like Patrick mahomes turns around and goes to him like three different times for him to make plays. And he would he apparently went up to him on the sideline and I saw this video. Not apparently I saw it happen, walks up and he's like, come on, man. You're gonna make some plays in this game, like, be us. And I'm like, Okay, that sounds like some coach Eric Taylor deal and Panthers. Clear heights. clear eyes, full hearts can't lose stuff. I'm fired up. Like, let's see it. Let's see it happens. Yeah, I mean, he doesn't know. They don't let anybody get their heads down. They don't get worried when they're behind because they know they can just light teams up. If anything, I think their defense might be a little worse than it was last year, which you could see Brady exploiting, Allen looked almost there to me, but it's just in a matchup like that where your team just gets punched in the mouth like three different times by clearly the best team in the NFL. Even if they lose in the Super Bowl. They're still the best team in the NFL as far as like talent and ability goes for me. The game might go differently, but I don't think there's an argument. But yeah, there's just so they score so quick, man. Like, I would not want my team going up against them. I really wouldn't. It would just it's bad.
Michael Marcangelo:The one concerning thing is that Travis Kelsey, and Tyree kill accounted for 290 out of the 325 yards, right? So, if you're nitpicking, if you just take one of them out, just one, right like Bella, say, We're like he takes away your best player. You can't I mean, Travis, Kelsey or Tyree, Clark can have 20 catches.
Dave Clarke:I don't know, man, they want a game with Chad henne under center
Joe Malkin:and converted a fourth down play where everybody
Unknown:was Cleveland.
Dave Clarke:He made a play and you back it all goddamn. Yes,
Unknown:you did.
Michael Marcangelo:I get to Taylor's. But I'm just saying like they are showing this, this ability to just focus on their two guys. tyreke Hill and Travis kelce. And listen, those are two great guys. So I definitely focus on them a lot too. But for me, I think the one weakness that we're not that we're not really that we're not really talking about here is that the actual running backs of Kansas City have not really shown up that much recently. Right. So I know Clyde Edwards hilarya has been hurt. Drell, Williams only, you know, 13 carries for 52 yards. Last year, they had another Williams that was running through everybody in the playoffs. So that also sets up Patrick mahomes in the play action, which I guess he doesn't really need because he can do whatever he wants. But if you get a really good defense with a really good offense against Patrick mahomes and and his what appears to be just very one dimension, Tyree kill Travis Kelsey offense. I think you have a shot.
Joe Malkin:Oh, Mike to the point we we talked about OFF AIR yesterday and then got the notification today. It does sound like leveon Bell is going to be active for the Superbowl and because of the injuries to Well, I understand but he's still running back right like 1111 on Belen Clyde Edwards hillaire are healthy you don't need 50 rushing yards from your your punt returner and fourth wide receiver.
Michael Marcangelo:I think Edwards hilarious the guy though like maybe like levy on Bell the way that he rushes doesn't really fit schematically with Kansas City. Right? I think he's there for short yardage situations. But Edwards Hilaire is dynamic, and they need him to do what he was doing in the first six games of the season. Again, I could be wrong. I've been wrong a lot. I'm going to continue to be wrong a lot. Maybe Patrick mahomes is enough. He was last year in the Super Bowl. But I think I just think if you go against a team that that can actually scheme for you. You need to be multi dimensional. And right now there it's literally just tyreke Hill and Travis Kelsey.
Dave Clarke:I don't see what the problem was just Tyree. It's like, What's his name? Jim Browns coach Paul Brown. When he was on the Cleveland Browns said if a reporter asked him Don't you think you'd go to Jim Brown too much? And he was like, well, we won the game. Don't worry. If you have the biggest cannon. You should probably shoot it. Like it works, so gives a shit. You know, I mean, it's like, it's too if it was one, I could see your point of view. It's like when you have one dynamic wide receiver like big, deep threat wide receiver and you can go like, whatever, we'll double them. We'll chip them at the line, which we'll chop, we'll do everything we can, like, we'll just we'll lock them down. But it's two of them. They play two completely different positions on the offense and they do two completely different things on the offense and Patrick mahomes finds them every single time. And he doesn't like he's just so good to that. You're so you're watching three things as a defense you're watching Tyree kill for when he's gonna turn around. Because when he turns around, he's so faster than turning to and faces mahones He's so fast than turning back around that you can't get him by surprise. You're watching Travis kelce he's like tight end play through over through the middle. Oh shit. He has me underneath again. Oh, shit. He has me underneath again. Oh, shit. He hasn't been anything yet. And you're watching mahomes in his feet. So that the middle of the field for any defense, I don't care how good you are. It's just it's it just sounds tiring to even say it. I it's gonna be a lot for them. I know they're good. But
Joe Malkin:Tom Brady is the greatest of all time. Aaron Rodgers is an elite quarterback. I really like Josh Allen. And what the Buffalo Bills are doing I think Sean McDermott has done a great job up there in Buffalo. Patrick mahomes is just, he's like one of those guys. I don't normally like to go out and buy jerseys of dudes. I've just never really been that guy. That's a guy that I'd be like, I want to go buy his jersey like I want his jersey because of just the guy. He is how well he plays moments, like Dave mentioned with me, Cole Hardman. And then you have the moments like, and I can't remember, I think it was last year. And I brought this up before but it's still one of my favorite Patrick mahomes moments. And it always will be is when they showed a slomo replay of a play, where he was rolling out and there was either a holding call, or there was some call. And he stops and looks at Terry McCauley in slow motion, he stops and looks at him as he's running, and then gets back into the play and like gains 15. And I'm like, Are you kidding? This kid is incredible. And then he comes out and admits that he didn't know how to read a defense in his rookie season. I mean, this guy is just out of his mind.
Dave Clarke:I think if they win this year, not to jump ahead. But I think if they win this year, we have a Golden State Warriors situation on our hands. And I can see with the discourse, it's already kind of getting to be that way. Because nobody wants to talk about the Chiefs because it's kind of boring to talk about at this point, because they're just Yeah, they're great here. And I mean, like, that's what you're always gonna say. And I see what you're doing, like, because it's like, it's just more interesting to think how could the Buccaneers beat the Chiefs? But in for all intents and purposes, realistically, the books aren't even the team I would have thrown at them. You know what I mean? Like, just, we'll see,
Michael Marcangelo:without previewing the Super Bowl, I just think that if we're talking about a team that is not being quarterback by Patrick mahomes, and I tell you that 22 out of his 29 completions went to two different guys. You'd say okay, that's easily fixable, right? Like you just shut down those two,
Dave Clarke:I've seen that the fuck was Green Bay doing it like what are they doing if they let those same two guys it's like that that house has been on fire for three and a half quarters, like do something. But they can there was nothing they could do about it. They just go We're just getting bullied by talent. Like sometimes they're just better,
Michael Marcangelo:more quick things. You're I promise. Travis Kelsey was the leading receiver in the NFL until he sat down week 17. He's a tight end. So it's bad. Like, I'm really trying to nitpick here for weaknesses. But to your last point, if you don't appreciate Patrick mahomes, you're not a football fan. That's just as simple as it is. Because this is the closest thing that we will ever see to a Jordan, LeBron Jordan, Kobe kind of transition. Right? This is Brady mahomes. Rodgers has all the talent in the world but doesn't have any balls. mahomes will do whatever he needs to do to win. It's been proven he's already a winner in his second year. He's in the Super Bowl again for the second time, his third year. I just think that that this is, you don't ever get to see the two greatest people from two different errors face off. Yeah, this is icon versus icon.
Dave Clarke:But it's also like he doesn't the greatest. And I'll just say one thing on that. Sorry, the The best thing about him is that mahomes is that he looks like he's going out to get his paper when he's playing quarterback. You know what I mean? Like, if you're gonna study body language, if you're gonna put kids down, sit down, and like watch Game tape. Like, this is what the other team needs to see. And like, that'll give you confidence or whatever it is. mahomes is just like, out there doing his taxes, or whatever he's doing. You know, it's just like, he just there's nothing in his face that makes it seem like he's got steaks. You know what I mean? Like that. He cares to be there at all. And then he puts in these performances. That was just to your point, Mike, but it's so impressive. It's like, you feel so lucky when you get athletes like this, like generational athletes because a lot of people hated Tom Brady because he didn't look like he was he he looked worse than he played. You know what I mean? Like he doesn't even look like he was supposed to be that good. So it's like that combine picture A lot of people hate him like the New England thing, like, whatever. There's nothing to hate about Patrick mahomes. For me, I like there's just, I don't know, try and find something because like, he does everything and you would love to have him on your team, you take them in two seconds, like every team in the NFL would say yes to that. So if you don't like Patrick mahomes, you're lying, or you're bitter that if you believe,
Joe Malkin:if you believe our executive producer, he's not gonna play past 2025. And if you want to find something that you don't like about Patrick mahomes, our executive producer will tell you that it's his brother and his girlfriend. But anyway, now that we've gone through a Tom Brady, yeah, sure. Go ahead.
Craig D'Alessandro:Yeah, I'd say, john, true fiance. I didn't say fiance. Clarify. But getting back to that mahones thing. I just listened to that whole diatribe for like five minutes. And if I didn't know that you were talking about Patrick mahomes. And the Chiefs right there, I would say or I would say, I would bet money that you were talking about Russell balsam and Seahawks about five years ago. It's not the exact same thing we were talking about.
Dave Clarke:Never had those kind of guys, but I'll say this, I think you might write a decent but not like on this level. I cuz that that defense is what really went anyway, it doesn't matter. I'll say this, you might be right about Patrick mahomes not playing past 2025. But that might be because he wins every Super Bowl from now until then, and bored and beating up on the NFL and has decided to retire. But it's gonna it's not gonna have anything to do with anything else. But the other thing is, he's got the feet, but it he can throw the ball so well. And it's like, even when he loses that, like, he's gonna be able to adjust his game and like, still be so elite, barring any kind of terrible injury. I just, he's gonna make the NFL less fun for the next 10 years is the only thing because you're gonna be the only person you're ever gonna watch the Super Bowl.
Michael Marcangelo:Also correct. Just to argue your point. Russell Wilson was the quarterback on a team that got him to the Super Bowl twice. Like he played pretty well. Right. But he was there because that defense, Patrick mahomes is in the Super Bowl and brought the Chiefs there twice. There's a remarkable difference. They are there because of him. That is it. Because he is the reason
Joe Malkin:Patrick mahomes right now at 24 is when Tom Brady was in his late 30s. Like he's bringing that, that that team to his legs. with legs. Yes. And and I still agree with Dave, though not to go back. I agree with Dave, if that field is open for Tom Brady. He's trying. He's got 1000 rushing yards in his career. I remember last season when he when he got the 1000 rushing yards in New England. And he refused to kneel the ball because he didn't want to go back to 999. So we've gone through the Chiefs side of it. And just real quick, we have to talk about the Buffalo Bills for the obvious reasons. The fact that they're in the AFC East, they're a rival of the team that three of the four of us here follow. So Josh Allen really liked Josh Allen. I mean, I don't like him as much as Patrick mahomes. But I really think he has what it takes as long as the coaching and the the personnel around him continue to grow and be what they are. But what's next for the bills? Are they the team to beat in the AFC East? And why is the answer? Yes. Well,
Michael Marcangelo:barring any any wild offseason changes, I think actually not no matter what they are the team to be there. There. They are the new standard in the AFC East. And I think it's simple, right? It's because you see the remarkable growth that he's shown you over the last just two years and just his completion percentage and went up, like 12 points since last year. I think there one weakness, which was greatly exposed in the postseason was there. They don't have that guy as a running back. Right. And I don't think that you need, I don't think the running back needs to be the best player on your team to get you to Superbowl. But I do think that you need to have a capable running game to get there and to be dominant. And it just hasn't been that but I think McDermott's a great coach. I think he's a really great coach. I think Josh Allen has shown that he's willing to develop and work on the things that he needs to work on to get better, and that GM went out and got him stefon Diggs. So for me, they're the team to beat and it's going to be hard to beat them because McDermott's a defensive guy, right? And that defense since he's taken over has given who we are who we've called over and over again in this show that the greatest quarterback of all time, Tom Brady, the his worst season performance every year that he was in that division. So for me, they're the new standard bearer. I think if you're a bills fan, you have a lot to look forward to barring anything horrific and unforeseen that I hope does not happen. I think it's going to be a good time to be Bill's mafia because they're going to be perennial playoff team moving forward.
Dave Clarke:And they just got together like they're a lot of their issues. If they had, they didn't have many obvious things. They made it to the AFC Championship game, but you know, consistency is tough for a team that just got together. There's things that they can still do. There's things that they can still improve on like yeah, having stefon Diggs is great, but I think we saw it in the AFC Championship grant game It would have been really great for them to have Yeah, sure I'm running weapon but also somebody that can take a little bit of pressure off of digs so you don't have to be stefon Diggs or be as dynamic as stefon Diggs but some other guys need to be out there making the same kinds of plays to keep the keep the defense's guessing. I think They could beef up their offensive line a little bit they could Alan's still raw, like he's great. And he's he makes super incredible plays and they're super dynamic, but there's still a rawness to his game. Great improvement from last season to this season as far as becoming a legitimate quarterback in the NFL and actually completing passes, which he wasn't doing before that going up against Lamar Jackson. I think you saw the difference that being able to sit in the pocket was like that storyline played out exactly how he said it would it's just like, who's gonna be able to make throws and it's more likely gonna be Josh Allen. He's been in the league for less time. He's still raw, he can still get even better the sky's the limit for that kid. You know what I mean? Like he can he could do a lot in this league. And yes, the answer is yes, they're definitely the dominant force in the AFC Sorry, I know you guys are patriots fans, so that's a bummer but it is just the case that definitely the team to beat and now the Patriots when they go back to the drawing board need to build a team to beat the bills.
Michael Marcangelo:I think you have to be really careful though. If you're the GM of the bills right now, because we've seen that like Josh Allen he thrives off of chaos being created like he doesn't need like I think you're right Dave like they should really be about that that offensive line because the last thing you want is this kid's career to be cut short because he's taking too many unnecessary hits moving outside the pocket. I also think if you draft a running back in the first round awesome, but it just smells to me like the those are gonna go and get Alan Robinson I just think that's gonna happen and if you haven't Robinson and Diggs nauert I mean now you're talking about a situation where you can't cover
Dave Clarke:you just can't and then Josh on a year later to make the same kind of leap Yeah, yeah, I doubt he will because I think he's only got a few more tweaks to make but if you can go even another half a level like he did last season or quarter level even. And you add another weapon like Robinson and just get a couple of decent like blindside tacklers, whatever, like, yeah, they'd be real, real scary. They're still gonna lose the Chiefs though.
Joe Malkin:That's what I was gonna say is that they're still gonna have to get through the chiefs. Right? Definitely the bills are going to be one of the forces in the AFC and that's painful to see with them being in the AFC East. I mean, I still think the dolphins in the Jets or the dolphins are closer, but the Jets are a long way away from doing anything. So I think at least the third spot in the AFC East although I like Robert, we'll get to him shortly. In the second half of the show. Let me make Craig really happy here. So one of the things we got to talk about in the storyline is something that that kind of blew our mind, Mike Well, two things right. So the first thing is, let's just quickly I call Beasley iron friggin Iron Man balls. He played the end of the season and all the playoffs on a broken leg. And then we saw him break it either again or more in that game and I sent a message to the discord was like Did he just break his leg and he went to walk to the sideline and you could just see something collapse in his right calf. And then he's back out there three plays later what I don't know what they're given this guy, but it works. And I want some of it for like a bruise on my arm because that's absolutely amazing. I think this guy is underrated. He actually had a great year is cold Beasley he's a little he's up there because he was in Dallas for a long time. I mean, he was in Dallas when Tony Romo was still there. It's been a long career for Cole Beasley, but with Alan Robinson there, is he a good number three for them to have.
Michael Marcangelo:Yeah, for sure. I think he's gonna be a 32 year old Cole Beasley next year, and if he's coming off of back off of a broken leg, who knows what you get. But I mean, if you think about this year, he has 82 catches for 967 yards and four touchdowns. And he wasn't serviceable. He was he you had to actually scheme for him, right so that he was a difference maker, which is always tough to be as the receiver that he has, because he's more of a slot type of receiver. So he made that that jump this year to the upper echelon of slot receivers. What I will say, what you saw from him in that game, is I think the reason why the bills are gonna be a perennial playoff team is he was willing to risk whatever it is his leg for his team. And that's because he believes in what his coaches doing and what his quarterback is doing. And I think that you like there's no you can put a price tag on that, you know, as far as what they're giving him it's probably the cane. He was really speedy for after a while, but I think I do think for me, I don't think he's gonna have a great year like he did this year next year. But if he's your third, I don't know that there's another wide receiving Corps in the AFC that that can stack up against it.
Dave Clarke:This is Colby so this is like his numbers haven't gotten like considerably better since he came to Buffalo or anything like he's had pretty much the same. He's pretty much having the same impact they used to have, right, or am I wrong about that?
Joe Malkin:No, it's gone up but I just feel like nobody's ever talked about him like, well in Dallas. He was just overshadowed by so much by two or three other guys that were there by DAC by by Zeke.
Dave Clarke:I think it shows up because he gets he does something that stefon Diggs doesn't you know what I mean? Like I was saying that like you need that and that Buffalo Bills thing but and that Buffalo Bills offense but you need I think someone who does a similar thing to stefon Diggs Do you have to worry about that guy like an allen Robertson? Robinson would be perfect. I really don't want him to leave the bears, but I will. But yeah, he'd be unbelievable there because it's like shit, we got to worry about him and Diggs, and then Bz is gonna beat us or neath. 50 times, and yeah, I mean, as a third for sure. But like, I was gonna say that before Mike did, he stole my thing. I was like, well, not next year, because it's like, hopefully they keep that team together for two I don't know.
Joe Malkin:Then the last thing that we'll talk about on this game was this wild series of penalties that took place at the end when we saw it all go off the rails for the Buffalo Bills. And it's interesting because buffalo always has this air about them, right? Like from their fan base to their team. They're always have this kind of gruff like it bills mafia, right. Okay, so the name speaks for itself. But at the end of the game, this was the first time all season under Sean McDermott like we've seen McDermott kind of lose it especially against Bill Belichick. This is the first time I've seen his team lose it, where Josh Allen gets thrown to the ground. He gets hit, the whistle blows and then he gets thrown to the ground by Alex Okafor. Josh Allen throws the ball back in Oakland for his face. Okafor stands over him. Oh four then gets pushed over by his line by Alan's line and john Feliciano, and another one of his offensive lineman Deon Dawkins comes in and has some words to say. And Michael is automatically like, well, that's like 60 yards penalties as an 18 yard sack. And that's exactly what it was. So Mike was pretty spot on. So Alan gets sacked for the 18 hours, and then there's 60 yards of penalties and he was like, wow, this isn't gonna be like a fourth and 55. No. And I explained this to Mike and Mike still like I just don't get it. Because all the penalties happened afterwards. Josh Allen of the bills assessed 15 yards for unsportsmanlike conduct. Alex Okafor the Chiefs 15 years for unsportsmanlike conduct. JOHN Feliciano and Deon Dawkins, both 15 yards for a personal foul. It doesn't matter who's the majority is Mike. It's just a matter that both teams were penalized. So everything offsets, and it's that doesn't mean because
Dave Clarke:that's so stupid. That's like saying, like you murdered that guy. So you got to get punished for that. But if you killed seven people after you killed that first guy, you still have to get punished for that, too. It's I think that throughout the NFL that's wrong. If they it shouldn't they should offset with math, not with the idea that a penalty happens. If I commit a 50 yards worth of penalties, and you commit 10 I go back 40 yards. It's really easy. It's really simple. Why don't we actually make
Joe Malkin:it? I think they do that for competition, because then you have a third and a better free play,
Dave Clarke:you get a free hit, then if you know that there's going to be offsetting penalties coming in. If these yellow flags fall flying in from both sides. You should punch somebody in the face because they're going to offset anyway. So it doesn't matter.
Joe Malkin:So on a different in a different way. So if and this is a very different situation, but if a team jumps offsides, should the offense get a free player, should it get blown dead right there. Anyway,
Dave Clarke:they do get a free play.
Joe Malkin:That's what I'm asking.
Dave Clarke:Yeah, that's, that's different, though. That's one team is committed the penalty. And part of that penalty is that you might risk a free play.
Michael Marcangelo:But if there was encroachment, right and same time, they would blow the whistle, right, fine. So if there's
Joe Malkin:a there's a 25 yard p i on the defense, and there's a 10 yard holding on the offense,
Dave Clarke:15 yards, 15 yards 15 yard gain easy.
Joe Malkin:We're playing cornhole at this point.
Dave Clarke:No, but the idea but you're saying that the reason why they don't call that
Joe Malkin:like Dave, I'm not disagreeing with you. I couldn't both people have committed crimes. There's worse crimes than other crimes. Yeah, but we're talking about football, not crimes.
Dave Clarke:Yeah, but they're crimes of the game. So I'm like, I'm just saying like when you go to when you go if you go to court, right, and you go okay, I murdered that guy. But to be fair, don't implicate male before that. It's like, ooh, those are offsetting crimes. How are they outstanding crimes. one's more serious than the other. Yeah, but they're both crimes. So they just offset Yeah, but they're both penalties are one pound. He's more serious than the other more one pound he has more contextual affecting effect affects the game in a more contextual and accurate way. So subtract one yard from the other yard penalty, Doom, boom, done called deep. Call him up. Let him know my new idea.
Joe Malkin:I was just gonna say that now Dave is working on two things with Dean right because of this episode. So Craig, let's make sure we tag him when we released this episode. So basically, what Dave's saying is that it should have been a 48 yard loss.
Michael Marcangelo:Yes. For the math I mean, I think we're I think we all agree that like it doesn't really make that much sense. The math doesn't I mean, quite literally does not add up in this circumstance. Right? So I was like, yeah, this is gonna be like a fourth and 55 and oh setting which is ridiculous. But there was another thing that we talked about here and show you said if if I saw if I was Feliciano and I saw oka four And Josh Allen's face like, I knock him down to torch I said, Well, don't let him get in Josh Allen's face in the fucking first time. Oh, let them blow by you. Yeah, he's there because you did not do your job. That's it. So it's like
Joe Malkin:to play devil's advocate on that, too is that Okafor was actually the second guy there and got flagged because the play had been whistled dead and Okafor threw Allen to the ground. So had Okafor just thrown Allen to the ground and Alan not throw the ball back in his face. That's a 15 yard penalty and automatic first down for the bills.
Dave Clarke:Yeah, well, that was stupid by Josh Allen. And like he's young. It was all still Yeah, I
Joe Malkin:know. Now, we're literally just mincing words here. So penalties
Dave Clarke:The thing is overall, and like as far as whose fault it is, or who screwed up more or whatever, penalties overall as an idea in the sport of football, not in other sports and other sports, sometimes you want to take it take a penalty, take a foul. Yeah, hit that guy to get go to the penalty box, that's gonna be good for momentum, get in a fight whatever. in football, it costs you yards, and the whole game is yards, Don't do anything stupid. I don't care if you were fired up. I don't care what he did. First. If I'm the coach of the team, you get your running laps every see you're doing suicides every time you cost us penalty yards, I don't care if it's a false start, or it wasn't your fault or whatever, you don't cost us yards. It's too important. So don't screw that shit up.
Joe Malkin:Except in the NFC Championship game where it was second and three. And the Packers knew that if they jumped off side it would keep the clock stopped until the next play. And it would keep their timeouts if they gave the Bucks The first rule that was
Dave Clarke:that was a good penalty, you shouldn't be able to buy yourself timeout. It's when by breaking the rules of the game. The penalties are there. You should never be able to take a penalty. And
Joe Malkin:that's how you feel about throwing the ball away too. Right? Yes,
Dave Clarke:yes. I don't think you should be allowed to throw the ball away. I think you should be grounding every time that that's like it. Don't you hate those plays? All right,
Joe Malkin:I got that that's a different show. And we're over 60 minutes and we actually still have like a half hour to go.
Michael Marcangelo:Can I just make one closing point about this? That Dawkins Feliciano if you're mad that oka for is and Josh Allen's face like love you make him? Don't let him get there. Stop him. Do your fucking job. That's it.
Joe Malkin:I hope they all hear this. So Super Bowl 55 will take place in Tampa Bay, Florida, or sorry, Tampa, Florida and Tampa Bay because that's Tampa St. Pete. It'll take place in Tampa, Florida on Sunday, February 7 in the Tampa Bay Buccaneers will be playing in their home stadium as the away team. Tom Brady against Patrick mahomes. It should be a fun one. Listen to us on Sunday, the 31st of January as we preview for two hours Super Bowl 55. Guys, do we want to keep going on to these storylines? Because we have some big stuff to talk about.
Michael Marcangelo:Yeah, I think we should probably do this on the two hour one. Yeah, we
Dave Clarke:should say we already ate a bunch of their content. I kept talking about this year like
Joe Malkin:that's, that's fine. We'll still have plenty of content to talk about. So up above. So that'll do it for this episode of missing the point. It was a good one. We only got to half of the stuff we wanted to get to But guys, I think we really effectively broke that down. So as I just said Super Bowl 55 coming up on the seventh of February, in Tampa, Florida. For Mike Mark Angelo DK, Dave Clark, DK sisal and Craig D'Alessandro the best EP in the game except for when he tells us the Patrick mahomes won't be in the league after 2025 I'm your host Joe Malkin. A lot of wiggle room at the trick. Get out of here. We will see you on Sunday for a two hour live show previewing Super Bowl 55. We'll catch you later.
Craig D'Alessandro:Thanks for listening to this episode of missing the point. missing the point is a one hour podcast recapping the biggest stories in the world of sports with the New England flavour. The show notes and transcript from today's episode can be found in the description box below, as well as on our website. www dot MTP show.com. If you're new to the show, please consider subscribing. It's the easiest way to see when we publish new episodes. We are on Apple podcasts, Spotify, Google and wherever you get your podcasts. Be sure to rate us and leave a review of any of our shows. We always appreciate your feedback. Let us know how we're doing and how we can sound better. Also, be sure to follow us on all of our social medias. All of our links will be in the show notes and check out our brand new website WWW dot MTV show.com that's MTP show.com. For all of us here missing the point. I'm Craig D'Alessandro. We'll talk to you next time.