Celtics Sweep Away the Nets
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In one of the most anticipated matchups in NBA Playoff history, The Boston Celtics eliminated the Brooklyn Nets in a 4-game sweep.
On this episode, we'll break down how the Celtics' defense held superstars Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving in check, while their own superstars, Jayson Tatum, Jaylen Brown, and Marcus Smart emerged as complete players and will look to keep the pace in round 2 vs the defending NBA Champion Giannis Antetokounmpo and the Milwaukee Bucks.
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Hosts: Dave Clarke, Bob Kelly, Joe Malkin
Producer: Craig D'Alessandro
Tweet your questions to @MTPshow with the hashtag #askMTP, email us at Craig@MTPshow.com, or leave us a voicemail on our website to be featured on the show!
Welcome to missing the point. I'm DKC. I'm here with a couple of goons. We're going to talk about Celtics Joe mountains here talking about Steve's with us and real BK Bob Kelly's here. And Craig's here somewhere, skulking around in the dark producer Craig, you know, doing whatever his thing is, we don't know we don't want to be associated with it because that's called plausible deniability. What's up dudes? We haven't the last Celtic show I think we did collect the last podcast was we were one oh up on the nets. Is that correct? Bobby was me and rent. Were one open the nets were feeling bullish. We were feeling pretty good about ourselves. We were predicting a kind of a collectively conservative run that didn't end up coming true because we swept them for nothing. Which I was really excited about. I'll start with you, Bobby. What What's What's your general overall spirit level at right now with with a four Oh, sweet.
Rob Kelly:Listen, I mean, even my bullish prediction ended up being given the next too much credit which is crazy to me. Like I got on here. I was hyped up and it seemed like I was like, the Homer be like Celtics in five. Let's go, bro. They fucking swept him. It's unbelievable. How it ended up going down. Yes, it was the closest I think was like the third closest sweep in NBA history. When it comes to like sweeps, the exact differential. Yeah, exactly. What what's most amazing about the whole thing is like the Jayson Tatum part is unbelievable. We'll get to his his haste against Durant one on one is just absurd. But the defensive proudness of this team showed it just really is what Ray was saying, or, you know, late later in the season this year is defense travels. And when you see defense in the playoffs, man, it's something that not a lot of teams have. And to play defense to this level two, you know what I mean? Game in and game out, like, honestly, like, I never got worried in any of those four games, because you're just like, broke, it doesn't matter. Because when it comes down to it, we're gonna get that stop. When you need to stop. It's happening. And it's just such a different mindset that we've had with the Celtics for the past four years. And we preach that on that show, where it's like, the mindset is so different. They wanted the nets, and we got them and they fucking dominated them for games. It's amazing.
Dave Clarke:Yeah, defense does travel, I thought they looked better. In the two away games in the in, especially the first their first half performances in the two away games and the consistency in that defense. This was absolutely a thing. Joe, we didn't get a chance to really chat about it prior to the series. So you're really not on record about the Celtics chances in that series. So you can really say you thought whatever you want, but to it's a two parter. What, how'd you feel going in, you know, and how close were you and did your expectations? Did they met? Did they change? How did it coexist in your head?
Joe Malkin:My expectations were met because as Ray said, and when we just said it five times defense travels. And seeing what Brad did with this team at the trade deadline. Working his way towards the playoffs. I like what he made does. I don't know if he may Doka is a great NBA coach. Now granted, he got it. This is his first job, his first head coaching job, his first playoff appearance. He'd beat Kyrie and Kevin Durant, and then that's fine. But what I think he does do is he motivates the right way. And he motivates these guys in a way that works for him. They're putting together a team, which is something I said vehemently against. Danny Ainge, for the last two years was, I feel like him and Brad are butting heads and bobbing and when I talked about this a bunch is that Brad and Brad and Danny butted heads and they were really putting a team together for Brad as the head coach. They were Danny wanted to put together his team. And I think that's the difference here. And the guys that Brad kept around, not trading away a guy like Marcus smart, bringing back a guy like gals Warford it's such a big move by a guy like like Brad Stevens, because I think he recognized that what he was working with didn't work for him, but it could work for me. So I was pretty high going into the series. I think that also had to do with the fact that I am just sick and tired of Kyrie Irving. I thought KD as much as I'll give Jayson Tatum all the credit in the world. And I don't want this next statement to take anything away from him. But I think Katie dogged him a little bit in that series. Comparatively, right? Like we know Katie is one of the best in the world, but I don't think he played to his best ability. And that's fine. I'm happy with it. Because Dave you're right at Sweet Sweet. So I was happy with this series. I this was the most basketball I've watched because I actually came around so call me a bandwagon fan.
Dave Clarke:Or bandwagon fan. Thank you. Sorry, I thought that's what She wanted me to do I
Joe Malkin:did. Not these guys, these guys are fun to watch. And they were fun to watch for that series, I have cautious optimism going into the next series.
Dave Clarke:I'll just say what I was going to say because I have to defend emails on it just for one second. Because I think you'd beat me to the punch, I think what we're like, okay, so coaching in different sports has different applications, and it has different effects. And by that merit, coaching is more important in some sports than it is in others. I think that you can have a great basketball team with an average coach and win a championship. I don't think that that's true in the say the NFL. Sure, you know, or do you think is the best example? Exactly. I mean, there's recent examples that just examples all throughout history now. You can like I mean, if Mike was here, he'd say that oh, eight Celtics product. But, but the, you know, the point being, I do think having a good coach can also win your championship in the NBA. And I think the way to see what a coach is actually doing is the exact things that we saw with the Boston Celtics in that playoff series, because one, Rob Williams goes down in the amount of impact that has now Bobby and I are going back and forth about Tice and how he can't do it. Rob Williams does but not a lot of people can be six, nine and have a seven two wingspan. That's, you know, that's part of it. But the fact that the drop off was so minimal, I think defensively, especially I think is a credit to EMIC I think they look at and Ray made this point on the last show they looked they do stuff like the prime pop spurs do. So that has to be somewhat his fingerprint as well. But although that's sort of the jury's still out there that sort of remains to be seen. But that's a guy who knows how to win a playoff series. You know, that's a guy who's been there and he's been in and around championships, playoff series, all that kind of stuff. And I think the fact that they stayed so consistent across all four games, and I'll also give him credit for whether it's indirectly by motivating motivating Tatum and brown and to be the stars that they are now and and to have that attitude they are or directly like in the huddle talking them through this. They had the killer instinct, they stepped on their fucking necks and I really think back at that comes like Jayson Tatum Jaylen Brown. We didn't have that before he may got here. They just didn't. So like I don't think I don't think they lifted off the fucking grass is all I'm saying. Go ahead, Bobby.
Rob Kelly:Yeah, no, it goes back to remember our podcast two weeks ago, bro, where we were sitting here. They had just gone into that final game of the season where we could have sat everyone and avoided the nets. And the Celtics did the exact fucking opposite where they didn't just play everyone. They played everyone and they absolutely fucking demolish that to hear what he may said about that today. Yeah, he asked the players and the players were like, Fuck, yeah, we want to not bring them on.
Dave Clarke:He was like, we're poor. We play basketball. We're not We're not marathon runners. We're not running from anybody or whatever. He said, I was like, that's great.
Rob Kelly:Listen, that's exactly why I was so high on them going into this series B literally, up until that point, DK we had the conversation about wombs, we had this conversation. I was very tentative. Until I heard that man and that, that just to me shows what a great job me really has done with this team. Because listen, that's not I said this before, they would not have done that last year, no chance no chance in hell would they have gone up and said we want this fucking team?
Dave Clarke:No, I think one of the biggest criticisms has been that they they seem disinterested. They were so soft, man. They seem that yeah, they were letting letting people roll over him. And I think that the thing that's changed from that time till now is is the head coach and like the culture and I think, I also think like, they have always had all the talent in the world like that. Yeah, I mean, it's great that we have the Al Horford of the world and he like he's losing, like, went to jail. And he's like running the perimeter. And he's like shooting confidently and like, that's all great. And like, it's great that our role players were 10 times better than the broken rule players. And it's great that when Blake Griffin started a little run, the Celtics of four years ago would have been oh shit and you're they would have let I guarantee you they would have left Blake Griffin beat them up. You know what I mean? Like that's like Tyler here starting to just fucking like be absolutely wet from the perimeter. Like we watched it happen to these teams already. And I just think, but as an aside, by the way, in that game, I think was Game Theory. Blake starts to just like, attack us. And it's like, why isn't Blake been on the floor the entire time? Yeah. Because Steve Nash, it turns out is not a great head coach, by the way. That's that's a side note. Yay. Okay. Yeah. I mean, Ray was right. We were wrong about that. So fair enough. But the Yeah, when he comes down, he starts to go out. It's what what does Jaylen brown do? Jaylen Brown takes the ball and goes at Blake Griffin just just goes out and once twice, three times goes. Alright. How long can you keep it up for like, Let's
Rob Kelly:go so gas to Blake. Yeah. Yeah.
Dave Clarke:So tired. Yeah. So tight. And it was like, yeah,
Rob Kelly:it was just dripping sweat. Right. Right, but
Dave Clarke:also like to speak to the mentality. They were like, we're not letting bucking Blake Griffin do this to us. We're not letting Blake Griffin do this to us right now. That's not who we are as a team and I think that leads me to my next point, the question I want to ask you guys, I'll throw it to Joe first. What do you think? As far as the prestige of the team, we just be, I know that you have your issues with Kyrie Irving and maybe it sounds like a little bit Kevin Durant. But I think it's a pretty fucking big deal that we just be the team with the best player in the NBA on it, which is kind of consensus at this point. And top three point guards, Bobby, top three, I would say at least you know him, Steph, and like, you know, like a little, maybe a battle between the Trey Young's and the John Moran. So the world like we're kind of right in there. Yeah, like maybe John. So that's pretty impressive. Like to me, and I think it's like the more Celtics fans shit on Kyrie Irving and Kevin Durant the more it takes away from the prestige of the win a little bit, you know, because I think it is a big deal. And I think that was going to be one of the hardest teams we faced in the playoffs. So what do you think that means? Joe? Like going forward? Like, do you see it the same way? I do? Do you think we can beat anybody now? Or is it more like I don't know. I mean, they you know, they're kind of mental midgets. Like you've been saying, like, they couldn't get it together? If anybody would have done that to them? Are we going to see continuation of that mentality? And that kind of aggression going into the next round? Or was it a fluke, because the net suck?
Joe Malkin:I think we saw the best out of the nets in the first two games of the series. And I think in the third game
Dave Clarke:they went into definitely, they definitely mentally quit, that's for sure. In the third game, they
Joe Malkin:went into desperation mode, and in game four, they quit. And that was that and that's not to I mean, like, like you guys said that though. It's one of the closest sweeps or Bobby said that's one of the closest sweeps in NBA history, but it's still a sweep. So it's like,
Dave Clarke:Alright, so that's a credit to us. Because I think one of the biggest one of the biggest criticisms was we don't we can't close out close games. That was like one of the biggest criticisms Yeah, and and we just did it four times in a row.
Joe Malkin:Right. And I and against two of the best players in the NBA, and that I'll give Kyrie that when he wants to play. He is one of the best.
Rob Kelly:That game one was absurd. Yeah,
Joe Malkin:but that's the problem with the NBA more than any other sport is that you don't have to play at 100% at two nights, and you can still be considered one of the best in the league. And it's like, this guy missed half the season because whether it was the COVID vaccination or
Dave Clarke:I mean, he's still playing fucking four quarters basketball though. It's like watch these what right fielders are scratching their fucking buttholes for like 182 games. Baseball so much I like it's like you don't have to try your hardest. Hardly at the charter bucking artists.
Joe Malkin:No, you don't and seasons 162 games. So it's an entire it's two NBA seasons on top of each other. With usually one day off a week. You're right, but it's not as much it's not as physically taxing. As a game like basketball. No, I don't take anything away from the Celtics. I don't do anything. I think this is impressive. My biggest thing with KD is him coming out and with his comments of why they should retire my jersey here and they should retire my dream. It's like Dude, shut up. You're still playing? Like let's talk five years after after you're done. And then let's talk about that because I mean, you think about a guy getting a number of retired or and this is kind of going off on a rant but when you think of a guy getting into a Hall of Fame, whether it's for a team for a league, a sport and having a number of retired it's about leaving a mark on that team. What Mark did he leave on the teams that like like should the Patriots retire Randy Moss is Jersey because they went undefeated in the regular season and lost in the Super Bowl. So should KD have his his jersey number retired and Oklahoma City that's kind of what what I throw out there on that I have a problem with him on that he's one of the best players in the world. I still think he's way too skinny. He's always been way too skinny, but it besides the point is how he looks is not something against him. And then in terms of Kyrie I just think Kyrie is a bum and what he did in Boston in the series was with and then to make him try to make himself look like the victim. I mean, that that was that's my biggest issue with Kyrie like just own it just own it don't you know But back to the original question Dave just because I don't want to go off on a rant it's too late ya know Celtics get all the credit here because of because of their defensive play Marcus smart walked into game one with a DPO why jagged on and he backed it up. I gave him shit for it in our Discord and he backed it up and he played a hell of a series and I'm not
Dave Clarke:best Marcus smart series in itself and reform.
Joe Malkin:In that in that comes from what we just said about email. He was right. When we were talking in the last piece about email and you were giving them credit. I agree. His rotations weren't perfect. In that series. Yeah,
Dave Clarke:I was like not angry and who was on the floor that didn't I feel like that's the number one thing I'm angry about when I watch basketball and I like there was actually one coordinate this quarter. I was like, Alright, put the fucking crunch timeline about and then I was I looked at the screen. I was like, wait, no. I was like, wait, no, they're all out there. But it was like yeah, it was looking like I was like, sorry, I just I I have like pre mad about it.
Joe Malkin:Are you saying email was a step ahead of you on like, Brad. I
Dave Clarke:mean, like, the thing is, is that I think, I think he, I like when the coach beats me to fucking like thoughts, you know what I mean? I want that to happen. And like, I think you're in a bad way. And I've been there with other teams that you know, will go and mention where you're going like, do don't do that. And then they do it and it goes terribly. And you're like, Why do I know more than you know, that's I don't want that for my coach, you know, so yes, I'm happy that for him. We've been living that for like 20 years. I want them to be yes, exact, we will know what we're talking about. So but I'm like, Dude, I mean, I want him to be 20 steps ahead of me. I want them to know 1000 times more about basketball than I do for sure. But like I mean, if he retires or wants to just fucking sit around with a bunch of other five jackasses and Yap into a microphone about it then we could like fade you know, the same amount but I need him to win. So Bobby same question. Do you what do you think the prestige level of the team we just beat us? Do you think that do you think that we beat how much of a lie was that seven seat you know, like how much of a mountain Do we just climb? And because to me the sky's the limit now because I have full on right at the Brooklyn Nets but like you know some some people maybe you're saying I they never really showed up mentally where you have them because of this stuff. Listen
Rob Kelly:the procedures at an all time high if you're asking me because Katie didn't just not show up
Dave Clarke:he's never that's never happened before
Rob Kelly:it's never it's never happened before we did that so it's not a lie you know? He just you know had four bad games no we fuckin forced that motherfucker to have four bad games that doesn't mean that three bad games he was awesome again for three bad games. But if you look at the stats man and I don't want to lead us into our Jason's but Jayson Tatum was so locked down defensively on Kevin Durant that it it just I feel like you sent a message to the rest of the team that is like listen our your star your number one guy is going at the number one player in the world and shutting him the fuck down. You better not let fucking what was the guy's name? BROWN You better not let brown go off on you or you better not let these dudes do this because listen, your guy is shutting down k d so what the fuck are you doing? Yeah. And he was just up in his face the way he was doing.
Dave Clarke:The obvious thing was smother. Smother Katie smile either Sean's No, he's the bomb. Boom, get in his way. I'd like it was fucking all time like gameplan hated it.
Rob Kelly:You could tell KD following it.
Dave Clarke:I honestly thought it was gonna freak out. Like, way more than he actually did. But on that note, I'll say this. Because I agree with you. I think after game one, there was three certainties in life, death taxes, and Kevin Durant going snuck in off next game, and then it didn't happen. And then after game two, you're like, alright, well, then now it's really going to happen. Because you just know in your heart, you're watching that you're watching the Brooklyn Nets go home and you're like, I would do what we're doing now. Like, we're gonna honestly like anybody with a discerning eye watching that series was going and going if you're going to take one. Let's take game four. You know what I mean? Like, we're going to take let's take game four, because you know, Katie's coming out to fucking play tonight. You know, he's gonna fall out and it didn't happen again. Which is crazy.
Rob Kelly:Not only did it not happen so game three is one that Joe I agree with you where he dogged and he wasn't up okay. Eat it bro. What did he had he had like four shots in the first half, which is fucking on heard of give
Joe Malkin:Jayson Tatum more credit on that though. And this is where this is where I'm going to kind of take Dave stance with with what he did with emails. I don't think Kevin Durant's ever been punched in the nose like that. Ever, ever, ever in his career, where he's had someone in his face I've never seen that's because
Dave Clarke:people can't keep up with him. It's not for lack of fair use is like Tatum Saito Tatum ability to be as fast as him. You know, like to get to the spots like him like into to
Joe Malkin:a lot of times she was there before Katie got there. He knew where he was gonna go.
Dave Clarke:He knows his spots. Did he watched his tape. He watched his tape.
Joe Malkin:And I've never seen defensively like that, ma'am. Yeah,
Dave Clarke:it's uh, you know, it's a reason why we were kind of, we're kind of leaning towards this maybe happened in the majesty and the narratives of the season because this is a guy that Jason teams modeled his game after. And this has been obvious since he got to the NBA like the way that Jayson Tatum plays is very similar to the way Kevin Durant plays, because they can both make their own shots wherever they want. So like, what's the most effective shot to make if you're like longer and faster than everybody else, like both of those guys aren't Now granted, Kevin Durant is fucking taller. But what does that mean? It means Jayson Tatum is going to add some other shit to his deep now playmaking we were all on fucking board with him adding playmaking to his game I still think he fucking stands up to how many triples but like honestly we're splitting hairs at this point the dudes a bonafide top five NBA superstar like backs, but that guy played a defensive game that I did not know he was capable of in a playoff series that I don't think anybody knew that I think he was like, he Kobe that shit he had it in his face. Think back pocket and he was going like wait until people because yeah, he was playing good defense offseason like I'm not saying it came out of absolutely nowhere, but I think he knew because Tatum has been like this. He's like, I'm gonna go up a level now. I'm gonna go up a level now I'm gonna go up a level in this thing now and I think for him to kind of be like, watch how good I am at defense though. Get up in fucking Cadis grill for four straight and it was so enjoyable to watch. It was so enjoyable to watch because you're like, it's happening again.
Joe Malkin:It's happening again. And it's and it was just fantastic. It was that enjoyable because not only do you see Jayson Tatum do it but Kevin Durant had no answer for it. In my mind, him getting a pass at the top of the key Jayson Tatum getting in his face, literally, like stomach against his ribs, and not letting him go anywhere. And Katy didn't he wanted nothing. And he looked uncomfortable. Yeah. And I think that that like you said he watched his tape. How do you make this guy uncomfortable? That's the way you make them make mistakes. And I think that comes back to one. Everything's going well when you're winning and when you're playing well. When you have a good coach when they put a good team around you when you're eight to nine guys deep and everybody can play and you can fill in for Rob Williams with Daniel Tice. I mean, look at I just love that that and this goes back to the Danny Ainge days, it just shows me how much Brad Stevens enjoyed having al Horford and Daniel ties here, because he brought him back and I know that seems simple. But if you really think of it on the level of what Danny Ainge did here in the last two years, with all the debacle he had with player, personnel and putting this team together, I mean, he's, we now have eight to nine guys on the team that can play at all times. And you can pull Tatum and brown off the floor for two minutes and still feel comfortable. And that's just that's a good problem to have.
Dave Clarke:Yeah, that's huge. I mean, that leads us well into the conversation about the role players I think we've touched on briefly the fact that Marcus smart had one of the best if not the best, I think definitely the best series he's ever had in southern uniform of the playoffs. We've talked a little bit about the Defensive Player of the Year moment him coming in, in the robe. And I just think that's the kind of swagger this team brought and I think we've talked about Marcus smart being our emotional leader we've talked about a common from him. You know, a lot of the huddles when you are when he's miked up or when they got a mic in the huddle you can hear him and he's just going no matter what happens we just stay playing we stay like we overcome adversity like he's just got this like mantra down so Bobby, let me let's talk to me about talk to me about Marcus smart like how important was the in the series? Well, you know, what did he do right and what do you want to see more of he stopped shooting he stopped shooting he shot a good amount Do you shot a good amount but
Joe Malkin:he shot well, because he was taking the shots that he can take not the shots that he was forced to take. And I felt like he was he felt that way and I think he was told you're the Defensive Player of the Year you're gonna have to play some offense on the other end of the court. But you know, let's get this set up the team the way the offense is running, it's running to set guys up for what they're good at. Not for what they think they're good at. And that I love that is that he took the shots that he can make and not just throwing the ball up from beyond three point ya
Rob Kelly:know 100% So when you think about what Mark is smart was before is he was a defensive to guard who exactly what you know what I mean. He just shot so much and he would force up shots he would do all these things. Now man he's so bought in to being that point guard that he's literally risen to a level where he's one of the best point guards in the fucking League and I don't think I've ever had more confidence in the shots that Marcus actually takes so I was texting my other buddy this that every decision that Mark is makes now used to be Marcus was the king of the No Oh, okay, bro I don't have those no moments anymore what the decisions that he makes I'm so comfortable with on the court now because it's just I don't know if it's me no 100% is me and his ability to just have markers buy into this system have Marcus buy into this role that he's playing? Like he's so important to this team and the mindset that they have that they've baked I don't even know the right that's the right fucking word. But this culture that they've like, just it's so amazing what he's done with this team man in the level that he's pulled his game up to like I know fucking jaw just my most improved player. But if you asked me there isn't a player that improved more this year than Marcus smart man. He's so unbelievable. On both ends of the floor. Now he without Marcus, we don't sweep that serious. You know what I mean? You think about that decision to pass the ball to Tatum. You think about those open threes that he was hitting? was facilitating. What was he in three points is the series mister percentage was definitely in the 40s.
Joe Malkin:So, just while you're looking that up, Bobby, I think one of the biggest things is you look at him and you say he's one of the most improved. I don't disagree that he's one of the most improved, but I don't think improved is the right word. I think he was a lost soul, if you will to get really deep and was guided back down the right path, because he had a tendency to veer off and have too much freedom. And I think that's one thing he made has done is brought the guys in and put them into the positions that allow them to succeed the best. And he's done that with Margaret smart. I think Mark is smart has always been this player. He just didn't know he could be this player. He thought he could. He just didn't know it. And I love that about him right
Rob Kelly:now. He was 31% it wasn't great. Whoa, really? That was that's really low. Yeah, no, it was a great probably
Joe Malkin:higher than his bench shoe. You know, it's
Dave Clarke:no that's actually lower for I feel like it's a low percentage for him. You know what though? I think threes he did hit were big. I think I think I'm a little surprised by that too. But you know what? I think it's it's 31% of a lot less shots. And I think his volume went down from around the perimeter so you're not seeing them Jack's Jakob fucking shots like Joe said he moving on to a couple of other role players. We got Rob Williams back in the rotation for the last game. I think they're back up to four minutes for the last game. He did like 15 minutes. I didn't really notice him too much in game three. Yeah, on pure presence. I think it's good that he's back. But uh, you looked a little rusty. He didn't look 100 bro. Hey, look, his timing was off. Yeah. And also like impact was immediate. Yeah, you know, I mean, I think he he definitely helped in there. I think he was like, he made a difference defensively. I think having that rim protection was definitely nice. But I don't think that they were kicking our asses underneath the rim for three you know two games up until that point anyway. And I don't know if I was like, like, I was glad to not be in a position to be calling for rumblings being like Jesus Christ. We're getting murdered. I know you've made me disagree a little bit, Bobby because you were saying some shit about Tyson?
Rob Kelly:Yeah, no. So that's the only thing with Tyson is. You didn't see Horford and smart yelling at Rob Williams. 80% of the game. Listen, Titus Tice is good at what he does but he's he gets caught out of position way too much. And I mean, I don't know if it's just because we know what it looks like with Rob Williams and how perfect and how amazing it is when he's at full strength but obviously it didn't affect him too much so I mean, it is what it is. I'm happy he was back in there.
Dave Clarke:It's but it's not as if it's not as if tight Yeah, I get it. I get what you're saying when you were saying it but it's not as if Tice was like
Rob Kelly:inept he wasn't inept right
Dave Clarke:but he wasn't like he was like definitely a bit of a liability and they were definitely making a ton of back cuts on him because he was just like not able to keep up with guys
Rob Kelly:whether to whether to stretch out or fade into it
Dave Clarke:he made some poor choices in moments but I think that we defended so well as a team that I don't think like a day like that we were so good at our switches we were so good at and then not switching as well. I thought that the way that we stayed dollar good on one on one matchups, especially Tatum and smart I thought they did they both did an amazing job of being like I'm not don't switch I'm staying with him he's not the screw the strings not gonna beat me you know what I mean? Like I'm just gonna like my I'm gonna use my footwork and I'm gonna run my ass off and I'm gonna stay right in front of them and I think that that helped us because then you're not that you don't give them an opportunity like we saw in the heat series when they just went like they went to zone on one end and then the other and they just like killed us on our switches because they were like, We know their switches we know when they're coming it's going to be this guy to this guy. Let's draw them out and then let's like cut them apart and that was happening to us so much it doesn't happen anymore because it those screens are tiring. And the reason you do them is so you can switch defenders and get mismatches or you know, like easy rolls to the basket. And when you're doing that and the guy still right in your fucking face like he didn't get eaten up by the screen he's still right in front of you like you sort of start to give up on that aspect of it too. Right. So I think we did sort of break them down mentally in that sense.
Rob Kelly:One person we can't leave without talking about is Grant bucking Williams Yeah, he had a great series this dude I have never seen someone take my opinion of them from you do not belong on a cord in NBA crunch time to literally earning yourself in a matter of three games a spot on that floor in the last two minutes of the fucking game and me being so comfortable with it and when he lines up that three point shot bro I'm you know what's in you know what I mean? Like if he's open he's hitting that fucking shot and I haven't seen someone that send like that literally since like Eddie house and that Oh way days where like I think he's I think
Dave Clarke:about it in any house. Yeah, I still
Rob Kelly:wrote it. So his stats in this series.
Dave Clarke:Think about game three was enormous. I know that he
Rob Kelly:went from averaging 11 minutes last playoff series last year to 30 minutes a game this series and don't forget 50% from three point in 70% from the field broke 70% from the field that is.
Dave Clarke:Also don't forget that those 11 minutes last season was we're about four to five minutes too many.
Rob Kelly:It's crazy. And we want to talk about Tatum's defense to talk about browser. You've had to talk about smart defense. Listen, he didn't back down from kady either. Yeah, I
Dave Clarke:was gonna say he was definitely the second guy on KD for the entire series. And I think he did a really good job.
Rob Kelly:That's really in your call, and you're okay with it. You know, last last year at this time, if you told me that Greg Williams is gonna go one on one with Jayson fucking Tatum in the playoffs, and we were gonna be like, Oh, word, let's go Williams broke. Not a fucking chance, you know, not a fucking chance. And now we're here. And it's a legit thing. It's real great. Williams is a legit NBA defender row player. And he's gonna be if we're going to make a run. Greg Williams is going to be a vital important piece of that run. And that's not something I was ever prepared to say before. Before this series. He was good coming. Well, you know what? He was good in regular season. But,
Dave Clarke:I mean, he was like, if he was like a 44%. Right. He wouldn't be here during the regular season. I think Yeah. I think he had a great series. I think everybody stepped up now is a good time then to move on to the next year, which I think we're all pretty sure it's going to be Milwaukee I'd be pretty surprised. They're
Joe Malkin:up like 25 right
Rob Kelly:now. 25 again, yeah. So
Dave Clarke:they forget to smash Chicago. They're good team. They're the they're the NBA champions, and they're not they're not to be trifled with. I think it's gonna be a hard road if we do get to these NBA Finals. So I think, you know, just to lead us off, I think I think the matchups are gonna be a little bit different. I think we're gonna need a completely different game plan against them. I don't think that Tatum can do to Giannis Antetokounmpo what he did to KD and that's not because he honest is better. It's because he's fucking enormous. And I think we're gonna we're gonna have to guard he's just going to take him to the post. And I think that we're going to have to guard Yiannis by committee. But what I think that means my kind of hot take prediction for this next series is, this next series at home is where we're going to see Jayson Tatum's, like 50-55 Point playoff game in this role, and I think that that wasn't I think he had great scoring games, but I don't think that was ever going to be possible with the job he had to do on Kevin Durant. And we just spent all that time discussing and I think that the smartest thing we can do is unlock him offensively because I don't think they have anybody on that court that can live with him defensively, not even close. So going in, it's going to be a different mindset. It's going to be a different game plan. But I you know, I feel like there was worse Celtics teams than this that that did a pretty decent job on Giannis Antetokounmpo. So Bobby, I'll start with you. What do you think going in? Are you scared? Where are you more scared less scared than you were against Brooklyn? I mean, I know your hype about the performance, but it's it's a different kettle of fish. Right. So what do you see going?
Rob Kelly:Yeah, man. I mean, so the key to this, we just talked about him is in the regular season, the guy that we put on yachts that actually did an okay job on him was Grant Williams, because you can match the strength streams? Uh, yeah, yeah, he's got he's got that lower body strength to stick with him in the post. It's going to be different than what we just saw for sure. I mean, I'm still picking the Celtics just because of exactly what we said. The defensive prowess we saw in this first round series. Chris Middleton is out which I'm not sure how much that matters anymore, because I feels like he's always out though. It feels like they can rely on it since he went out. They absolutely dominated the bowls, three straight games since that happened. I think it's like 25 points, 20 points. And now Joe says better when he's not there. Now they're up 19. And it kind of seems like a Ewing theory to me to quote Bill Simon's real quick, but like, the UX theory is bullshit, though. Like, let's
Dave Clarke:be honest. So Patrick Ewing didn't make the fucking Knicks worse.
Rob Kelly:But yeah, I mean, I don't see it. At the same conference that I saw that first series, I think Yanis is going to give us a little bit more problems. And KD did because like you said, we don't have the matchup for him. So a yawn is 40 point 15 Rebound game. Sure. That's inevitable. And we said about last year's Who the fuck no offense. Do we know why it's different, though? But yeah, so it I think that's inevitable in this series. I still like the Celtics and six if it gets a seven, again, because of that demeanor we had at the end of the regular season, we get game seven at home. And I don't think there's a bigger home court advantage in the NBA right now. If I'm being honest, like that's, that's a legitimate thing. It's like Boston is a fear fucking place to play in the NBA Playoffs. So yeah,
Dave Clarke:another reason why you should watch winning time. I mean, I'm just saying. But no, I agree. I'll go to you next the it's so good,
Rob Kelly:bro. He's very he's been pitching this show for like a month and a half now.
Dave Clarke:Just trying to do your favorite Joe gotta be sweet spots. Yeah.
Joe Malkin:Yeah, right. I'm with Bobby. I think it's going to be less of a defensive flight, which sounds weird, right? But I think we're dealing with it. team we're going to have to run with and keep pace with rather than a team we can get in the face of and back down their benches deeper.
Dave Clarke:Yeah, the real players on the Fugu nets were absolutely trash. I
Joe Malkin:know they're awful because well, that's because they spent all their money on the big three and Blake Griffin. So besides that, yeah, the role players on the bench for the Bucks is much more like ours, like these two teams are very similar. I don't think either one of our superstars are as big and strong as Yamas. But I think they they do things better than he can in other aspects of the game. I like the Celtics in six, two, I think there's going to be a game like Bobby said where you're gonna get a 4050 and performance from Yanis and they're gonna you know, again to use the analogy again, they're gonna punch us in the nose and kind of knock us out and bring us back down to Earth because right now the Celtics are on top of the world they're on Cloud die and you know people are starting to say Celtics warriors in the NBA championship and it's like well guys sled let's slow down. I mean, you got to Mavericks team that's playing like the Celtics did without Rob Williams without Luka dodge, I mean, and then that Mavericks team is pretty scary. Nobody expected them to be so I mean, you know, I look at
Dave Clarke:so the heat minus Jimmy Butler last night. Yeah. And
Joe Malkin:making it to any like to stay on the east shore. It's like, you know, but so who knows, I mean, everybody people going to speculate so far out and it's like, Guys, let's look the series play out. But I liked the Celtics and six because I think overall I think they have, the better, they're going to have the better coaching and the better discipline to stay in the game. And of course, all we heard in the first series was way see which games Scott Foster has seen which game Scott Foster has, so let's see which game in the series Scott Foster was the official one. And maybe we'll know how it goes. Although he's so fucking bad dude. And the Celtics benefited from it and game for so.
Dave Clarke:I mean, they tried they tried so fucking hard to keep that series alive. It's like it's not even
Rob Kelly:ours, so yeah.
Joe Malkin:Oh, yeah. That was that was one of the worst offensive fouls in the playoffs. I've never seen him. He doesn't give a fuck, dude. No, well, he doesn't. They also had a officials meeting in New York like three days prior to that game for something. So that sounds
Dave Clarke:like a party. I want to be at the officials meeting. Let's get a bunch of referee types in it with
Joe Malkin:Adam Silver. And the NBA officials. There are some good ones. I love that by the way. I love the sideline cameras when they do reviews and they come right up and they like they're like as close as I am to the camera right now. And they're like looking down on you. I think that's the coolest thing they've added in the NBA a long time. I Celtics something we
Dave Clarke:just got an insight into what kind of porn doing Joe watches POV POV strip POV strictly attached.
Rob Kelly:POV is good too. I mean, just
Dave Clarke:who does it you know you gotta get you got to put your mind.
Joe Malkin:In La guys, yeah, we can't have MTP after dark waters.
Rob Kelly:So So anyway, so wait, let me so first of all, the Celtics right now are is this is not something I thought we would be talking about our favorite in the fucking Eastern Conference to come out and go to the finals. At this point,
Joe Malkin:we're pleased that after is that after they won the series, or before
Rob Kelly:after they won the series, so that's updated odd plus one at the net, not to not to the heat, or like plus 210 or something like that. So their second subjects are favored to come out of the East right now. That's true. That's how high Vegas is on the Celtics versus not so
Dave Clarke:yeah, so I was trying to get you guys to say is that it's fucking wild that we BKD in the nets, though, in the fashion that we did in the way that we met and like it means
Joe Malkin:that we're serious in the playoffs probably at least in the last five years the best defensive performance
Dave Clarke:I've ever seen in the entirety of watching basketball so performance I've ever seen because it's not those guys just don't have back to back back games in the playoffs. They just don't and then we did that and it's fucking insane.
Joe Malkin:Like you said, just to get to go off that thought Bobby to before you go. Yeah, that's that's where you said it earlier. And I think we kind of skimmed over a little bit was that's kind of pops mentality, right? Like, guys bust their ass and play their butts off and you know, you have your superstars. You have your big names. And then you go and do what you have to do to win the series no matter what it takes. And that's very Gregg Popovich esque and I think he makes channeling that a good thing for for Celtics fans.
Rob Kelly:And was as I want to pitch something to you guys that I didn't think I didn't think would be a possibility coming into this right. So it's very possible that three weeks from now, a month from now, however Jinxy this seems takes us both not it's not. But it's so let's say it does happen right? We go on this run it is what we think it could be. It's very possible at the end of this fucking season, Jayson Tatum was being talked about as the best fucking player in the world. And that is something that I was not prepared for coming into the season cuz you Think about right? If we go on this road, what does he have to do?
Dave Clarke:Right? Let's talk about it when we get there Beat,
Rob Kelly:beat Yiannis right? Beat the Heat. And Jimmy Butler and impossibly go up against fucking Stefan curry, or go up against fucking John Moran. Like the things that he will have to do to get to this point, it's an actual possibility that after this entire run, Jayson Tatum is seen as the best fucking player in the world. And that's not something I was prepared to talk about coming into this fucking playoff run but listen to them are talking about right now. Kevin Durant for four fucking games, and that's it's a different mindset now was the you can't make a list, right of the top players in the NBA and get to the fifth spot without mentioning Jayson Tatum. He's top five. That is a real thing that we are at now. So like, if this run happens, he's going to be above and beat he's going to be above yo kitch. Like, you know what I mean? Like you just go down the list. And even if we get to the finals and lose, he's still above all these dudes going into the next season. And that's like, going into this year, he was top 10 Maybe. But because of what we just witnessed what the domination he just had on to rant. If he gets past he honest, he gets passing beat rope, guys, the fucking limit, man sky is the limit.
Joe Malkin:There's a big youth movement going on in the league right now. Because you have your guys like Kyrie who's a little bit older, he's not as old as a KD or LeBron or blit. Like Blake Griffin, not that I'm putting them in the same breath as time but like, we are getting the new young crop of guys. And as Ray has said many times, it's a four to six year window for a guy like Jayson Tatum. And we're at the back end of that four to six year window. So Bobby, I'm with you. I'm not prepared to have the conversation right now, as Dave just alluded to, because it's an alternate reality we could live in. It's not no, it's uh, it's the current reality. But we got to get there first, like finish the trip, but it's like a cross country trip we're going to see No, seriously, like you're we're on a cross country trip to go see Dave, I just picked you up in New York. And we're like hitting the Pennsylvania border and you're like we're about to see Dave and that's like, No, we still have like 500 miles left to go. Like let's get there first facts you have pretty good luck for we before we start talking about it, but the reality is we are going to see Dave and you know Jayson Tatum is going to be considered the best player in the world because that's the trend that we're going on. And I don't think he has
Dave Clarke:everybody slowed it down.
Joe Malkin:Very pleased. I understand that it's probably we got it we got to get there first because there's no way we can have that conversation now when he hasn't done that yet.
Unknown:Don't Okay, don't put a talk. Don't look at
Joe Malkin:your drink, isn't it? This is the this is the heat series all over? Yeah,
Dave Clarke:that was you.
Joe Malkin:I was trying to put his blame on Bobby Dave just
Rob Kelly:if we do this, I'm serious. So think about what we just saw. Okay,
Unknown:we talked about Milwaukee Can we talk we can talk we can talk about we'll talk about we'll walk into psych but if they got to
Joe Malkin:go through to our Eastern Conference series just to get to the finals and Milwaukee hasn't even won it yet like we don't like the heat could pull off some ridiculous comeback in the fourth quarter they could go on to win the next two games and we could be playing the Miami Heat when I trout
Rob Kelly:notables he meant I'm sorry the balls we're sorry that's not gonna that's not gonna happen. We're playing Milwaukee
Dave Clarke:it's more likely to Jayson Tatum gets talked about at the end of the season as the best player in the world that it is for us to be playing the bowls in the next round.
Rob Kelly:It's just crazy man that like we went from this to can't close out games to him. Just dominating for
Joe Malkin:straight differences. What do you think the difference is now
Rob Kelly:any? I think it's I mean, bro. I think that's what it comes down to is like, he does have a smokin hot wife that he does have it as that's a fact. But like the proudness and respect for the head
Dave Clarke:coach, please. Yeah.
Joe Malkin:I just said his wife is gorgeous. What do we get
Dave Clarke:out? That's coach bro. God,
Joe Malkin:I'm not gonna be wearing green. That'd be a different story. You
Dave Clarke:know, people run laps right now. So he's quite honest with you needs to run a lab to go
Rob Kelly:I didn't listen. I'm just it's something I thought about earlier today that I didn't think would be an actual possibility coming into this year and it's on the fucking table. It's there. And if the Celtics perform up to what we think they can it's fucking there for the day. Yeah,
Dave Clarke:I like just to create like a little bit of a counterpoint here. I'm also like projecting myself into this like utopian future that you've created for us. Brown wondering I'm wondering what I'm wondering when we get there. If we get there when we get there. I'm wondering what the other fan bases are saying. Because but just hear me out hear me okay, so like the just comment, fuck down for a second Hear me out. So the other thing and bases I think if you're saying that like yeah we got through KD and he dominated KD. We got through Yiannis in the Bucs you won't really play one on one defense against him. We get through Jimmy Butler, he's Jimmy's probably not going to be his guy. For most of it. I'd say Jalen, or Marcus need to be on him. Probably, Marcus, I think you get through this. I think a lot of people are giving us credit as a team. But I don't know if you're saying you can put Jayson Tatum on any team in the NBA, and he's gonna win you a championship, which is kind of the required level of reverence you have to a specific player you need to have in the NBA, it's like when LeBron was the best player in the NBA, which he was for a long, long time. It was if LeBron goes to Miami, they're gonna get championship, if he comes back to Cleveland, they're gonna get a championship. If he goes to LA, they're gonna get a championship. And it's like, you can just put him on any team because the bronze there, it's going to accelerate that team into into championship land, which, considering how bad some of those Cavs teams actually were, I think, you know, it was like pretty fair to say, I think LeBron could kind of do it almost by himself. I'm not saying he has to be able to do it by himself. But because of how good this team is, I think a lot of people are going to be going like, Yeah, but like, look at the schemes that you may have Joker was running up. Look at how good Jalen Brown is the next guy next to him. And look how good he is. He had a few fucking new lights out performances. But how could a team do if they're gonna be saying all the shit? We've
Joe Malkin:been saying Jayson Tatum is a system quarterback?
Dave Clarke:No, of course not. He's an absolute Savage. I'm just letting you know, that it's even if the things that like, even if those things all come true, and you and I know that Jayson Tatum is the best player in the NBA. I don't think he's ever gonna get talked about like that. I really don't. I don't think it's I don't think he's in the situation. I think people will make the point. I don't think it's an outrageous point to make. If all those things come true, I think I'm gonna think it I think you're gonna think it. I think that makes a
Joe Malkin:lot of No, I'm
Rob Kelly:gonna fuck it. I
Dave Clarke:know, you're gonna think
Joe Malkin:you're already thinking I'm already there.
Dave Clarke:But I think that there's a lot of very smart people in the world of basketball, that would be going it's still Kevin Durant. And I think that they would be in a way they'd be correct. And or they'd be saying, I don't know, it's still staff like liquid he can be, you know, however, whatever you there's going to be it's going to be arguably the best player in the NBA. It's never going to be what is sensitively,
Rob Kelly:arguably, man. And that's good enough for me. You know, that's good enough for me.
Joe Malkin:To counter Dave's point and sit you on the bench with your Week Six cowboys are beating the Patriots mentality right now. And they're gonna be so far beyond
Dave Clarke:the fucking cowboys.
Joe Malkin:Not close. My counterpoint to that would be you brought up a guy like GDX. And he brought up a guy like Steph, KD can't go anywhere in the league. And when we've seen that, Stephens played his entire career in the same place. Now he's won. He's won the championship multiple times. He's also been hurt, and he is on the back end of his career. I mean, could would they really be part of that conversation? Because I don't think
Dave Clarke:I mean, it was like, he just was the consensus best player in the NBA going into the season. It was just, it's just the way it is. And I just think the reason for that is, I mean, he wasn't able to win, like, if we're doing if we're gonna, if we're gonna have the discourse about Katie's whole career. I mean, it's pretty easy to defend it. He wasn't able to win an Oklahoma City when from his rookie year till however many years he was in league. I think, Russell fucking Westbrook and I think it's possible when Russell was broke, because his game he went to the Golden State Warriors, and he made them into arguably the best basketball team ever assembled, and they fucking they won chips because they weren't fucking nasty. Like they just weren't because of him. And then he came to Brooklyn, and it hasn't worked out yet. But I mean, it's not gonna we've just spent this entire time talking about how fucking good the nets are. Because Katie's on fucking Diem though, you know what I mean? And I just and I think, what the only point I'm making a balmy is, if both guys became free agents, even at the end of this season, I think a lot of really smart people would take Jayson Tatum on their team to go try and win a championship but I think a lot most people would still say Kevin Durant, because it's just the way basketball fans think. You know, like, kidney Yeah, Katie got shut down in the series. I absolutely agree with you. That did happen, but that I mean, are we gonna say Katy sucks now? Like, that doesn't make any sense. It's like he's still Kevin Durant.
Rob Kelly:You know what I mean? So but it's way more of a conversation than ever. Absolutely. Absolutely.
Dave Clarke:It would be and he would definitely like I think he just got to the top five. So I'm personally happy here. Like I think it just happened three days ago. So like, I think you're a little greedy. But like I think he just got to the top five and I'm and I'm, I'm now going to litigate the foundation, because that's what we do here. We're going to litigate the foundation of why he's a top five player. Before we get laughed out of the room on he's the best player in the NBA. I think
Rob Kelly:we all know that I like to build the house before the fucking founding. Okay, that's like when that's literally my MO is what a horse cart right? That's what I do. But like we You've listened when you list it's crazy when you list the top five players in the NBA, Jayson Tatum has to be a listener to be great.
Dave Clarke:On this side, so I know I agree with you. Is
Rob Kelly:it okay? Yeah, you can take my excitement and pull it back a little bit. All right.
Dave Clarke:I mean, you're creating a false reality. And I think that and I think in creating your view a little bit of a fucking Jake's to be honest with you, because that guy's got an ACL just like everybody else. So like, let's just calm the fuck down. I mean, like, let's just calm the fuck down, like you're talking about, but like, the thing is, it's sort of contradictory in its own hypothetical, because you're saying like, look at how huge of a mountain he has yet to climb. But if he did climb it, he'd be the
Rob Kelly:best guy. Already, so it's like he's already at Basecamp three though. You know what I mean? Like, I get it,
Dave Clarke:but if you're had balls, she'd be your uncle. But she doesn't so she is. You know what I mean? It's like if if what could on that note, I think we can I think we can wrap things up. I think that was a lovely chat about the Celtics. I think I love your enthusiasm and Yeah, fuck it. Why not? Jayson Tatum is the best fucking player in the NBA wasn't wrong about we can just say that, because
Rob Kelly:Celtics and five was under and what is
Dave Clarke:it this way? Yeah, fair enough. Fair enough. I'll say this to you right now. I wouldn't trade him for all the fucking tea in China. I wouldn't trade him for Kevin Durant. I wouldn't trade him for Kevin Durant three years ago. I wouldn't trade him for fucking LeBron James circa 2012. I wouldn't trade him for fucking anybody.
Rob Kelly:The ceiling is higher than then. Yeah. I'm not even talking about believable.
Dave Clarke:I'm not even talking about next season. I'm talking about for the remainder of this playoffs. I wouldn't trade him for anything. I wouldn't trade him for Prime Michael Jordan. I like exactly what we're doing right where I'm
Rob Kelly:gonna before you ended up, we're gonna go into another small rant real quick. And Joe, you said earlier KD is too skinny. Right? I couldn't. I couldn't do more. Because when you think about it, right. We always talk about JT who's KD like, is this like, Bro? Jayson Tatum can body Kevin Durant at this point. And Eddie didn't bother
Dave Clarke:you. He just games not body and him. He was he was playing. He was playing one on one defense with
Rob Kelly:me. But like he's just stronger than him at this point. And if he's going to be Katie white, he already has another aspect of the game that Katie has never had. I'm telling you, Kate, I'm sorry. I'll stop. Jayson Tatum ceiling is so high because of what he has that like we've never had.
Dave Clarke:I Kevin Durant is not too skinny. I think you can it is, if you want to see, if Kevin Durant needed to have a different body, I will just show you his body of work. It's like, it's it's fine. I
Joe Malkin:think he's one of the he's one of the best to ever play the game. But just bobby temper your expectations and your excitement for two seconds. Because Because and I'm just warning you. And and to offset your Jinx. There is a possibility the Celtics lose the series and he has a bad game. Like that is a possibility. Now the nice thing is, is they get a few days to rest because Milwaukee still has to finish off Chicago as they are. They're 23 as we record this in the fourth
Rob Kelly:quarter is already finished. It is
Joe Malkin:but what I'm saying to you is they get a couple of days off. But you know, I this is where I prepare with you. You specifically to wait a week down the road. And for you you'd be cursing the same things that you're praising. Because it happens all the time, especially in football.
Dave Clarke:Well, it hasn't you noticed that just to be fair, just to be completely fair, it hasn't happened so far. It's playoff run. And I'm not I'm not gonna sit here and hope that he's wrong. Like when he talks about the capitalists. It's not the same thing. I think I ended up at the end of the day. I think I give you a lot of credit for the tapes you had in the last series. I think we all had some good ones i and I'm very excited about this Celtics team, I just think just like they would do in privately in the locker room. We're going to take it one game at a time. And we're going to take it one series at a time at most. So looking forward to the Milwaukee Bucks looking forward to talking to you guys again when we have played a couple of games against them. And then we know a little bit more about what the series looks like. We should definitely get a show in the more in the middle of the series. That last one ended a little quick. It was tough to get together because the smoke had already fucking cleared by the time we were able to get this thing going. But that was a good show. Glad we're all here. Listen to us on the missing the point stream and we're also doing a show a week over on the 617. This week we're doing one about the Patriots draft with two of our other contributing members Mike Mark Angela and Rachel on Buchanan. So go check that one out if you haven't already. And yeah, thanks for listening. We'll see you next week. Go CS