Tackling the Predictions for the Upcoming NFL Season
Diving Deep into Division Standings, Rookie Sensations, and Coaching Showdowns
Get ready for a touchdown of an episode on "Missing the Point" that's set to redefine your NFL season predictions! Join us as Dave, Mike, Bobby, and Ray dive into a thrilling points game, covering everything from divisional rankings to rookie sensations. This isn't your average podcast – it's a clash of insights, a rivalry of perspectives, and a whole lot of gridiron chatter.
Our journey starts in the fierce arena of the AFC North, where we ignite a passionate debate about the Steelers' game strategy. Are they charging full throttle for those projected 11 wins, as argued by Mike and Rayshawn? Or does the grounded prediction of 8 wins, advocated by Robert and Dave, seem more likely? But we're just getting warmed up. The spotlight shifts to the NFC North, where we dissect the Vikings and Bears. Will the Bears triumph with double-digit victories, as Dave anticipates? Or is Mike's more conservative prediction of seven wins right on the money? And let's not overlook the fortunes of teams like the Lions, Jaguars, and Dolphins – we're gazing into the crystal ball of gridiron fate.
As the heat intensifies, we plunge into AFC East predictions. Can the New England Patriots make a triumphant return with double-digit wins? Or are they facing a reality check, echoing the thoughts of Mike and Bobby? Our analysis spans teams like the Eagles, Cowboys, and Raiders, balancing records with team dynamics. And in a climactic finale, we take a daring bet on the first coach to face the firing squad.
Brace yourself for a rollercoaster of uncertainties, rivalries, and astonishing revelations. Grab your virtual seat because this episode is your golden ticket to deciphering the NFL season ahead. With a sprinkle of rivalry, a dash of discourse, and a wealth of football expertise, we're here to dissect, converse, and explore the enigma of the gridiron. Tune in now and get ready to conquer the upcoming NFL season alongside us on "Missing the Point"!
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Hosts: Mike Marcangelo, Dave Clarke, Rayshawn Buchanan, Bob Kelly, Joe Malkin
Producer: Craig D'Alessandro
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Dave Clarke:
It's missing the point. It is the AFC NFC prediction show, our annual show, where we do exactly what it says in the title we predict the records of both the AFC and the NFC, and those are the two conferences that make up the NFL. We have a little bit of a shake-up in the personnel this year. Myself, the usual host extraordinaire of this wonderful variety show that we put on every year for our loyal fan base. I will be participating because we had to break up the Mike and Bobby wonderkins that were 3-0. Considering it's a season-long game, my point to the rest of the guys was it was going to take half a fucking decade to catch up, if possible. So we're resetting. We had a really fun three years. We've been doing the podcast for three years. We've been doing this prediction show the entire time. It's a lot of fun. Essentially, if you haven't listened to the show before, what we do is we split off into teams of two. The teams are going to be Myself and Mr Mike Marcangelo. We're going to be the NFC team. Robert Kelly and Ray Sean Buchanan are going to be the AFC team. We had to split up Mike and Bob because they were just too good at this, so it's going to really come down to? Am I the deadweight? Am I the person that's really going to fuck this up, Because the two stars of the show are now separated and have to play each other?
Bob Kelly:
It's a real Shaq and Kobe situation. Yeah, Shaq and Kobe, Tom and Bill.
Dave Clarke:
We'll see who the real genius was of this whole thing. But this is my first year, so go easy on me. I usually just have to kind of reign you guys in, reign in, you chuckle fucks, but now I have to actually pretend like I know something about football. So here we are. We've shaken up the rules a little bit, so I'm just going to explain it from the top. If you, if you've listened to this show before, great, there's going to be some changes. If you haven't listened up, because the rules they're silly, they're fun, they're zany and we're going to have a great time. Within one game is the newest rule. Last year we had to call the records of our, you know, respective conferences within two games to get one point. Now it's within one game because we're just trying to make it harder, because we were just too fucking good at this, or you guys were at least. So now you got one, you, one point if you call a record correctly, within one game. So if you call 13 and how many games we play in the NFL this year, 13 and 5, if you, if you call, if you call.
Bob Kelly:
I'm still 17, stuck in the past in a four or two and four.
Dave Clarke:
We're adding games every fucking year. If you call 13 and four and that team you know then goes 14 and five, no strike that, reverse it. If that team then goes 14 and three, you get a point because you're within one game, and vice versa. So that's pretty straightforward. Additionally, this year, if you call a division in the correct order you know, one, two, three and four so say you call the NFC North correctly bears, lions, vikings, packers you get an additional two bonus points. So that will pile on to that. We're going to do a little thing called call your lock this year, where we're going to name our one lock on the entire conference that we're predicting. This is the prediction show and if we get the lock right we get an extra point. So two points for that team instead of one. Call arrival, which is we get to pick Mike and I get to pick an AFC team to call their record and vice versa. And if we get it closer or exactly right, then we steal the points from the opposing team. And just to be clear on that, if we say, for instance, we pick the Patriots and we call the Patriots record exactly correctly at the end of the season and you guys call the Patriots record exactly correctly at the end of the season. We get the point. You guys don't write because it's a full blown steel. So, and the same works for you guys. So if we both get it right, the stealer wins. Right Advantage goes to the man running to the base. So, additionally, we're also going to make name our collective predictions for the MVP of the league, rookie of the year and defensive player of the year and, depressingly, we're also going to call out who we think in. Any on any team doesn't matter if it's your, if you're the AFC team and you want to call an NFC team out for this, or vice versa. How many times can I say vice versa? On one show you get to call the first coach fired. So we're going to, you know, I mean we don't want to be messing with people's livelihoods, but I don't think our calls are going to influence any sort of any sort of things there. Call it in the air. We're going to each pick either heads or tails to figure out who wins the coin toss on the first game, just to, just to get some points on the board. You know, just for a little fun, to start the game off and in the playoffs we're going to play final jeopardy. We're going to take all our points that we got from the regular season this isn't something we did last year and take all our points we got from the regular season and we're going to gamble on games. We're going to bet against each other in in the in the respective playoff games when we get there. So this game is a lot of fun. Some arguments happen, you know, friends are made, but it really it's all about what we learn along the way. So I think I'm going to get started. What I love to do is I love to go by the cardinal directions of the map. I'm going to start off with the AFC team, just to throw it to you guys and get you involved, and we're going to go north, southeast, west for both teams. So you guys will do your north AFC north predictions, we'll do our NFC north predictions and we'll go so on down the line tomorrow and tomorrow and tomorrow. So, gentlemen, robert Kelly, ray, sean Buchanan, tell me about that AFC north Whenever you're ready. Just you know, don't mind me. Anytime now, any time now, any time you want to go. I know.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I said go ahead Bobby twice, all right.
Bob Kelly:
So we got the bank. So, personally, we actually had some difference of opinions here on the AFC north. So personally I have bangles 13 and 4 Ravens.
Dave Clarke:
Oh wait, can I actually interrupt you for one second? I'm so sorry. Minor piece of housekeeping. You got this written down, or do you need me to write stuff down as we go and you'll just send it to me afterwards so I can keep it in the records? Okay, great, thank you.
Bob Kelly:
So we got bangles 13 and 4, steelers 11 and 6. This is Ray Sean's prediction. Steelers 11 and 6, ravens 9 and 8, browns 8 and 9. I have bangles 13 and 4, ravens 11 and 6, browns 9 and 8, steelers 8 and 9. So clearly there's some difference of opinion here with the AFC north. This is the one we differed the most on. I just want to make the argument here that I do not think the Steelers are in any position to go 11 and 6 this year. I have made that very clear on both shows that we've done so far about this season. Other than that, I mean the bangles 13 and 4, ray Sean. I mean I don't want to go out on a limb this early, but I think that's my walk over the AFC. Is that bangles at 13 and 4.? I think that I haven't been so sure about a team dominating a division in quite some time. I think they're by far the best team in that division. The rest of it I'm okay to mess around with. I don't know about the Steelers at 11 and 6, but the bangles to me at 13 and 4 are my walk of the entire AFC. I hate to get that out of the way that fast, but like I've never been so sure about a team winning division this early into the season.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Yeah, I mean, listen honestly, for me I think it is the progression of where Kenny Pickett is going. I feel like he figured it out towards the end of last year. So I think that's where you know he starts to take off. And once again Pickett is another year under the system. You know John T Johnson, you know they got that rookie out of. She's got a UGA on Washington, who I wanted you know here in New England. So they just to me, my tunnel just finds a way. And once again they scratched the clock to nine and eight and it wasn't that good last year. So I just think those guys another year under the belt, 11 and 6, I said we can, we can split the difference and go 10 and 7. I'm good with that, but the difference S the D.
Bob Kelly:
Are you okay with going Ravens 10 and 7, too? So we'll make them both 10 and 7. And then the Browns. We can stick them at eight and nine. That's fine, yeah.
Dave Clarke:
Wait, hold on a second. Hold on a second More house debate. Are you going to? It's going to do. I'm going to write down what you land on, because I know you have your separate predictions written down, but we're going to need to lock in what you actually decide on. So do you?
Rayshawn Buchanan:
want me to write yes, yes, so, yes, oh, I'll say one more time. So bangles before.
Bob Kelly:
We don't have to decide if that's actually a walk or a walk yet we can do it at the end. But I'm just pitching that early Bobby's making up the fucking rules.
Dave Clarke:
now he's. It was final answer a second ago, but all right, it seems a fucking shambles. Mike, we're going to take these apart.
Michael Marcangelo:
Bobby hasn't been so sure of a team where you've divisioned since the Cowboys last year. That's all I'm going to say.
Dave Clarke:
And two years ago. All right, sorry, you got the bangles at 13. For who else you got?
Rayshawn Buchanan:
You got decided so Ravens still is both a 10 and 7?.
Bob Kelly:
Yeah, yeah.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
And then the Browns at eight and nine.
Dave Clarke:
Yep, got it. Thank you All. Right, mike, do you want to talk about the NFC North?
Michael Marcangelo:
I mean, I got things I got things I figure you should lead off the NFC North.
Dave Clarke:
Okay, no problem, we're not super far away. You had the Lions at nine and eight, the Vikings at eight and nine, the Bears at nine and eight and the Packers at seven and 10. I had the where the fuck are mine? I had the Lions at 11 and six, the Bears at 10 and seven. Now I did change that after I saw yours because I was a little farther away. I mean, they didn't want to spend the entire show arguing with you. So I said that's fine, that's fine, I don't want to jinx anything, so it's cool. I had the Lions at 11, six, the Bears at 10 and seven, the Packers at seven and 10 and the Vikings at seven and 10. So we're a little far away. I think we should talk about the Vikings first. I think that my opinion on this, if I could just try to sell you for a second is that if we all knew that Kirk Cousins wasn't the playoff guy and he wasn't going to be able to do anything substantial next season or in the postseason, I should say they didn't know that and that they were sort of like riding this regular season high. I think that the knowledge that they don't have a guy to throw the ball enough. Well enough in under the spotlight in the postseason is going to create a malaise around that Minnesota organization. I think that they know that they are the also rands of the entire NFL. I think that the fan base knows now, I think, that their expectations are low, despite their roster, despite having arguably the best wide receiver in the NFL, despite having a really really solid defense and a really really solid offense overall. I think they know that Kirk Cousins isn't their guy and I think that's going to creep in. I think they're going to win a max seven games, especially because I think the rest of that division is going to be difficult for them to play against, more so than it was sort of spread out last year. They had two tough games against the Packers last year. Now I think they have four tough games against the Bears and the Lions. I think if we settle on the Vikings losing a little bit more in my direction, I think, I think I would feel really good about that and I would also be more willing to compromise going forward, because I really want to say that the Vikings are only going to win seven games.
Bob Kelly:
So this is a future sell. This is the future sell. I'm just putting my chair.
Dave Clarke:
I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm letting you buy equity in my goodwill, the goodwill of future, of future persuasion.
Michael Marcangelo:
So, like, the hardest part for me about that is I just find it hard to believe that it's going to be such a drastic fall off from last year. I say that had no way that they get rid of double took, went to four straight provils and that solar powered card has five running by doesn't mean anything, has five prime time games this year, so I assume that he's going to go one in four or five minutes. So I'm willing and with me within one game. So I think that they're going to be eight, nine, so I can go seven and ten.
Dave Clarke:
Okay, great. I'm glad we settled there because I wanted to go five wins but I moved around a little bit. I mean, listen, I I'm being a little hopeful about this division. I swear I'll get more pragmatic as we move on through the show. The Bears I want to give the Bears the ten wins for obvious reasons, but I also think I can sell you on on their them hitting double digits this year.
Michael Marcangelo:
Yeah, one question before you get through the sales pitch. Do you think in your heart of arts that 11 wins as possible? Yeah, yeah, stop, no, no, take your bear shirt, do you?
Dave Clarke:
really know we're going to deed his t shirt Because I think ten wins. Why is why I had to?
Bob Kelly:
I had that t shirt. I was going to say that I should thank you.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, it's really good if I need to camouflage myself in a sports sporting good store. The, the yeah, of course, I think 11 wins is possible. Here's why. Here's my sales pitch Justin Fields end of end of sales pitch. I think that it's not really the end. I have more third year maker break, huge roster overhaul. We now have an offensive line. Dj Moore, woefully underserved from the quarterback position to his, to his abilities in his entire career, has had an amazing preseason so far, despite limited snaps protecting the starters. We have Colcomet, one of the one of the best of the rest in the tight end pass catching class. Once you get you know, anybody that did a fantasy football draft over the last few days realizes that you either get Travis Kelsey maybe you can make an argument for Mark Andrews and then you have literally every other fucking tight end of the NFL. So, if you know, I'm not saying that Colcomet's that, but he's a good pass catcher and he's good yards after catch. I think we have an identity now. I think we have a defensive identity now. I think we put a lot of really great athletes on the on the defensive side. You and I had a conversation about a lot of the free agents we put on the on the roster as well as a really solid draft, and I think we have a really good backfield. I think it's really pacey and explosive and I think there's like a lot of high upside guys that we might see like actually doing stuff there. I still think that fields is the most exciting player in the league and I'm not going anywhere on that and I think that if you and I, selma and Louise, this thing, if we hold hands off this cliff, mike, you're going to have so much fun cheering for the Bears this year.
Michael Marcangelo:
You're going to be cheering for 11 wins, buddy, it's going to be great. Are you proposing 10, 10 and seven?
Dave Clarke:
I'll get. I'm saying I'm giving you 10 and seven. I wanted 12 wins, but, like here, I'll come down to 10.
Michael Marcangelo:
Yes, I can take 10 and seven.
Dave Clarke:
Okay, great, this is going so well. The Packers I said seven and 10 for the Packers, you said seven and 10 for the Packers, so I'm happy to just land there, if you are Well.
Michael Marcangelo:
I'm changing it. I think it's going to be eight and nine. Okay, because the only reason why I want to change that is because I do think that Jordan Love will will do better with the young wide receivers and Aaron Rogers did last year, so he might trust them a little bit more. Throw to them often and I don't think nine wins is a lot of question, which is why I want to hedge and say nine, but I don't think that I think they're going to win more than seven games.
Dave Clarke:
I do. Don't you think that they potentially are looking down the barrel at six L's in their own division though?
Michael Marcangelo:
And I think they'll beat the Vikings twice. You think they'll be the.
Dave Clarke:
Vikings twice. We should, we should lower the Vikings record, then They'll probably split with the Lions. You think, dude, the Lions are better than you think Well, I guess we'll get to that when we get there.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
But eight and nine for the Packers, like you're going to represent it for them.
Dave Clarke:
So you know, yeah, I just think, I just think you're underestimating slightly the impact of of a guy like Aaron Rogers leaving a organization, and I think that the identity of the Packers in the past decades, if not more probably 15 years, is that. How long he was there? I don't know. It was a fucking nightmare. I try not to remember.
Michael Marcangelo:
Well they were. They were what? Eight and nine last year, and he refused to throw to one of the rookies that was relying on the show.
Dave Clarke:
They were eight and nine last year and they had one of the best quarterbacks in the league. Yeah, so we're saying there's still going to be eight and nine. Think about it. Yes, all right, I'll give it to you. Yes, whatever, I'm happy to ride with you on this. You have a great track record with Colin Packers. Packers records on this show. Like you, just nail the Packers every year.
Michael Marcangelo:
Yeah, but he's gone now, so I don't need to worry about it.
Dave Clarke:
All right, man, I'll give it to you. So we're saying eight and nine for the Packers and then we just have the Lions left. Now you said nine and eight. I really genuinely can see them win an 11-12 games. I really think they made a lot of adjustments on their on their roster. I think they did exactly what they needed. That the team I'm the most scared of in that division personally, and you have to remember like they were top of a ton of metrics last year, Like they had really big holes that caused them to lose really close games. But they have a good team Now. I don't believe in their quarterback, but I believe in literally every other, every skill position that they have. I think their wide receiver I'm enrausing Brown might be my favorite wide receiver. Like might be the wide receiver I like watching the most. He reminds me of like he reminds me of a young Tarell Owens. To be honest with you, I think he's got like all those qualities. I think he's like really fucking underrated and I got pipped to him in the fucking fantasy draft yesterday by, I think, one of you fucking cunts. So I think it's important to one of you guys. Have them, or was someone else? No, you guys are still cunts. So the the important thing to remember here is they, their record, I think flatter to deceive. Last year I think that it was. It was a little bit inflated in the loss column and I think that if you I mean I can I can see you being careful with an 11 and six record with them. But you know nine and eight I think is a little low. So if you want to meet in the middle, you know I'll go 10 and seven. What do you think of it? 10 and seven because I did.
Michael Marcangelo:
I I think 12 points is out of out of a round of possibilities for me. So yeah, I mean they also have.
Dave Clarke:
They also have a decently tough schedule, but I don't want to get bogged down in the strength of schedule conversations in these, in these things, and we have to move on. So, ok, we'll go. Let's see, we're going to go. 10 and seven for the Detroit Lions. We're going to go. What do we say for the Vikings? Eight, nine, eight, nine. So keep that. What did it see? I can see it's fucking hard because I'm talking to you and I can't fucking write shit down at the same time.
Michael Marcangelo:
Sorry, we went eight, we went eight. Sorry, we went seven and 10 for the Vikings, we went eight and nine for the Packers.
Dave Clarke:
I think we went 10 and seven for the Bears. Ok, that makes sense. Let me write that shit down. You don't have to give me a second.
Michael Marcangelo:
Don't meter, keep, keep track. That way you can keep the hosting thing going all right, if you want, if it's easy for you.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
No, hey, hey, I see self.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, you guys want to do the FC South next, do it.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
So this is the only one that we fully agreed on, because it was just like it to me with. It's the most. You know, it's not even a toss up, it's just we just know who's gonna be. We didn't that division. So are we at Jacksonville 11 or 6?
Bob Kelly:
We have Tennessee 9 and 8, the Colts 5 and 12 and Texas 3 and 14 and and so originally we thought I thought we were walking one per division originally and when we did that, the Texans were our walk at 3 and 14 in this one. Just because it just they absolutely to me it's them in the box are the two worst teams in the NFL and I think that's the most lockable thing that you can put On the books for this year. The rest of this division I mean the only outliers to me, I think it's the Titans. I think they're they're a tough team to call. I think they could easily win 11 games this year, but I think it's just safer to put them at 9 and 8. Jags Jags are one of the division, right.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Yeah for sure. I mean, listen. So Trevor Lawrence, I mean how you got national pundits put in, trevor Lawrence, the rep, the, as a top five by receiving a quarterback do one they haven't even played. You know, kevin, kevin, really such off the the slots you know again.
Bob Kelly:
But this is all to keep a fan do over those fan do parlay's brother.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
He's dropping the parlay's, so I mean, you got to get back at that, the shit too. But we'll talk about that as well. But yeah, yeah, jacksonville should be the cumulative coppers division and I say, yeah, I should run away with it if everything goes right so you had Jaguars 11, 6 Titans night in a cold seven ten Texans 3 and 14.
Bob Kelly:
No, cold, cold 5 and 12.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
And then Texan, yeah, and once again I'm you know I'm a Gator fan and love, love Anthony Richardson. I thought that he was very raw talent, while the he has an ability to be really good at some point, but obviously with you know, they're losing John to Taylor. You know Jimmer say just doesn't know what he's doing as the owner, so he's very inept as an owner in my opinion. I'll start of having pan manning and even wasted that situation. So I feel like it's gonna be like over. You know, remix of the Curtis Payton years, you know which was crazy. So they're not gonna be that good to share. So, yeah, five, five as well.
Bob Kelly:
We talked about Anthony Richardson at Florida last year man week one. Who did they play they? I'm on y'all Utah, utah, yeah, we Utah week one he showed up that game. He's got some talent but I don't know what's going on down there.
Michael Marcangelo:
Yes, unfortunately, Mike, what do you think about their ASC sound prediction I mean, I think that this is one of easiest Divisions to predicts, right especially the one wild card in this could be if Anthony Richardson decides and actually balls Like, then he's gonna, he's gonna fuck it all up three. But I mean first-year quarterbacks and I Don't know if I trust the cold. I like Jacksonville, I think Calvin Ridley, christian Kirk, that's that is that they're really really good water seeding core and yeah. But we've been saying the Texans are gonna be like one or two wins ever since to Sean was getting his massages, so that doesn't surprise me.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, I mean the Texans. I feel like you only gave them three wins because you got to be within one right, Like it's like you can take a potentially win one game, but there's no fucking need to call that right Jacksonville. I mean you guys got a decent amount of faith in them. Do you, Ray, you really believe in Trevor Lawrence? Huh?
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Yeah, I'm, listen I we know he does.
Bob Kelly:
We know he does yeah.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I was ready to give my 16 jersey with Lawrence on the back, like.
Dave Clarke:
I'm glad you. I'm glad you say that, because I would be interested in trading you for your backup quarterback on your fantasy football team, so we can talk about that offer too, just because I know now that you really believe in Trevor Lawrence. So I just think I think you should put your money where your mouth is. But the I'm just saying, and also you know, if you don't want me bothering you about it every fucking week for the next 16 weeks, that's that's another reason it's Justin. Yes, justin feels is the backup quarterback. For some fucking reasons, just right out from under my nose Ray, I'm not bitter.
Bob Kelly:
No reason for literally.
Michael Marcangelo:
Literally.
Bob Kelly:
It was my favorite part of the fantasy draft to be honest is like the number one moment, so I'm still annoyed about it.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Are you want to talk about this?
Dave Clarke:
NFC south. This, this despicable NFC south Division. There there, michael the dump.
Bob Kelly:
Yeah, so so worse, worse division AFC south or NFC south.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
But he goes like I don't know, I might be a tie.
Dave Clarke:
And I think the floor is lower for the AFC south, but I think that the ceiling is a little bit higher for the, and I think the AFC south is worse. I think, yes, and the FC is worse, because I actually am a little higher on the Falcons than you, mike.
Michael Marcangelo:
I think we should start there, yeah, so I was actually gonna start with the Falcons and say that I have them down at nine and eight. I think that they're they should be in ten and seven. I think you know Arthur's that doesn't get enough credit for getting the most out of the town that actually has in the field. I mean he made Marcus and ariota look like a actual NFL quarterback until he just left Middle of season. I think that offensive line is Much improved. I think Drake London is a really good receiver, kyle Pitts very tight in and they're going to have an offensive Rookie of the year can be in the genre of its they absolutely. He's so beast is stung man yeah so yeah, I mean my pitch would be ten and seven. I don't because I think they could win 11. I there is not one bone in my body that police that they can win 12 games.
Dave Clarke:
You know what, man, in the words of the great meatloaf, you took the words right out of my mouth I, I'm with you. Let's go ten and seven for those fuckers. I'm high on them, honestly. For all those reasons, I really I believe in. I believe in the modern NFL, that Coaching is becoming more and more important as the margins shrink at the top. We have so many good elite NFL players now, like the college programs are getting better, the high school programs are getting better and better, like every year as we go on. I think that the only way to really see a team Stand out when you don't have I agree that they have Bijan Robinson, but when you don't have those you know marketable, like super star skill players, the only way to tell what what a team is going to look like is if they have a good coach. I think that you know you see Examples of this across the league. I think you see more intense examples. On the other end, I think you can see really good teams get really hamstrung by shitty coaches, what that makes shitty decisions. You know we've talked extensively about how the Patriots should have been a lot worse over the last five years. You know what I mean if they didn't have the maestro at the helm. So I agree with you. I think that I think that that coaching stuff is really impressive. I do. I agree with you that I do. I agree with you that I think that because of Marcus Mariota's performances and and I was the last guy in that in that fan club, so I didn't see that coming at all, you know, I do I think they're going to want to fucking shoot both. No, but do I think that they can beat up on the teams in their division? Yes, that being said, moving on to the Saints, I I never love to, I never like to count them out too badly. I think that they're a pretty well run organization. I think that they've been a pretty Stalwork playoff team in the in the NFC. Obviously drew breeze had a lot to do with that, but they've been a stalwart playoff team in the NFC for a long time. I think that. But I mean again with how your franchise is run. You know the fact that they got drew breeze in the circumstances in which they got drew breeze is it just goes to show that I think they kind of know what they're doing down there in Nolans. I think that their Fan base is great and I think that they're a hard place to go play, no matter what their team looks like. So I had them at nine and eight and it looks like you had them at where the fuck? nine and eight, nine and eight. So I think we could settle on nine and eight. I could see them getting ten wins in in a kind of a like Eight and nine actually feels, to be honest, as I'm talking, eight and nine feels like a little bit more of a Safe bet because I kid, I, I'm doing that thing in my head where that you do, where it's like Well, could they get ten? And I just I don't know if I see the Saints getting double digit wins this year. I do you think the picture get the picture, get seven. Yeah, I think nine might be their ceiling. Is what I'm saying. Does that make sense?
Michael Marcangelo:
Yeah, I mean, I just look at it this way. I think Derek Carr is a step up from james once in, and Jason though I think that he is that they probably have the best defense in that division, that they probably have the toughest place to play in that division, and If michael thomas does decide to play football this year, it will just be, you know, gravy, and so that's why I was a lot of there's a lot of wild cards there.
Dave Clarke:
You know what I mean. Like I feel like I feel like with I feel like I could see them win in five games. You know what I mean. Like I I do think that they're a well-known organization. I don't love to count them out, but Ten wins for the Saints this year.
Bob Kelly:
I just, I just it doesn't compute, dennis Allen not shot paid too as the head coach right, well, yeah, but I mean they're 16 and 18 over the last two years.
Michael Marcangelo:
So I mean they're, they're, they're close, they're, they're hanging in there and I do.
Dave Clarke:
They're under five, they're under 500, and you're saying they're gonna be like three games over it. I just don't know. Well, no, I said nine and eight. All right, we both agreed, I was. But I was thinking that that that ten wins ceilings, that ten wins ceiling. I just don't see it. I think we should cushion ourselves. I really think we should cushion ourselves at that. We get the nine, we get the eight and we get the seven, but fine, it's fine, this is, this is this is, this is the, this is the good will that we uh, that you racked up with me earlier with the Minnesota Vikings. So we can, we can go with the, we can go with the New Orleans Saints and nine and eight. That's that makes sense. It's not? It's not crazy, you guys, it's not insane. They do have a bunch of shitty teams to play, like the Carolina Panthers. They're in a full fucking rebuild. In fact, I, we, I had them at seven and ten and I think that should. I think that should be lower. I think that should be lower. I think that I think we should put him, if I think we should put him a five, five wins, no, I, who do they have?
Michael Marcangelo:
I think Bryce I think Bryce young is actually going to be a A good quarterback. They got adam dealen as their, as their number one, who was a pretty good.
Dave Clarke:
I'm feeling like nine thousand years old in wider seabree years. Doesn't he like his, isn't he?
Michael Marcangelo:
29? Yeah, that's what I just said.
Dave Clarke:
He's like nine thousand years old in wider seabree years. Do you remember any fucking targets he used to get in minnesota, dude? I've seen that guy take hits that like he's 29. He's gonna be in a nursing home next year, but also like in france.
Michael Marcangelo:
Frank right, that new head coach was able to get like 10 wins out of jacobi percent, 10 wins out of spill-up rivers.
Dave Clarke:
10 wins out of Uh, what the hell was their quarterback garbage time in garbage time, like the wins that the wins at the pan. But but it but an indian atlas.
Michael Marcangelo:
I mean so I think. I mean I mean garbage time in the season, I mean garbage time in the season, you know.
Dave Clarke:
I mean, it's like that he was winning games. It didn't matter. I think that like, Uh, I don't know man.
Michael Marcangelo:
I, I feel like.
Dave Clarke:
About six and 11. Here's, here's the reason. The reason why I'm saying we should lower it is because I think we're forgetting now I'm not saying the buccaneers are going to be a fucking world-beating team, but I think we're forgetting that the buccaneers have a lot of good skill players, still Like. They have a lot of decent fucking players on their team. I know that tom brady's gone. I know it's a mess. I know that they mortgage their future for a Super Bowl, which I don't really have a huge problem with. To be honest with you, I think of rings of rain, but I don't see the Panthers finishing above them. I just don't see it. It's just not crystallizing in my head. This is why this division is hard to talk about, because it's not who's good and who's bad, it's who's bad and who's worse and it's like right, it's like I just Like both of those teams are just fucking bad. You know, like I think both the Panthers and the buccaneers have potential to be really, really bad. Like I think other if you take out the Cardinals, I think both of those teams have the potential to be one of the two worst teams in the NFC. And it's really depends on what you're like, what the buccaneers can put together with the players that they have, because I think that they could still exploit some positions, but the fucking Panthers don't have anybody. I don't know. I don't know, I mean.
Michael Marcangelo:
I feel like I did name who they had and you just qualified them based off Because those names don't mean anything like that's like Adam Miles Sanders, now Miles Sanders.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, you were big on him last year, right, I think, I think I think Adam Thielen can be, can be the third best wide receiver on a good team.
Michael Marcangelo:
He would be a Patriots number one wide receiver, but wrong division.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, so I don't think that changes what I just said at all.
Michael Marcangelo:
I had them at 7 and 10. You think that they're five inch 12.
Dave Clarke:
Can we just say seven on six and but and in that sense I think we could probably keep the bucks at six then too. So it's where we're within one on both. So if we say six and 11 for the Panthers and six and 11 for the Bucks, I know that that doesn't make sense mathematically for their divisions, but I think that within the rules of the game, then you're kind of spreading out your. It's like you're putting your chips on different colors, right? So yeah, I'm okay with that. I just wanted on record that I think both those teams fucking suck. So I've gotten that off my chest now. So we're good, I feel like what? But they have Bryce young. It's like come on, dude. I tried. I mean, yeah, I know, but you're hinging your argument on Bryce fucking young. It's like what's going to be tough argument.
Bob Kelly:
It's a tough argument.
Dave Clarke:
What's going to be different, like what's going to happen. Did he swap brains and bodies?
Rayshawn Buchanan:
with someone. It's the same thing with CJ Schraub down in Houston. You know it's about to become the kill the Williams. You know sweepstakes, yeah, like that's what's about to become. So either those guys are produced like kill the Williams when we're first guy off the boy next year. So from USC, that that's just it's true.
Dave Clarke:
I think I think the I think that you know, I mean I said this when the Bears got the number one pick this year, I was like trade it, like traded immediately and that's what happened so, and we turned it into a lot of good things. So I think that I mean I don't know, he just has flopped written all over him to me, but we'll see what am I going to say. And I, you know, I don't mean to shit on the Panthers I really appreciate that fucking sweet package that they gave the Bears. It was way more than that pick was worth, especially when they used to drop Bryce young. So, moving on, let's go east. You guys want to do your AFC East predictions?
Bob Kelly:
Yeah, ray, you want to leave this one off me, yeah, so of course we had the most discourse on this one.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Obviously, I wonder why. So yeah, so Bill's 13 or four, bobby had Dolphins 11 to six, just nine and eight, and then the Patriots seven and 10. I so I had no really that, not an eight on mine. And what's to get at the nine and eight is the ceiling, which is why I said that, once again, just there is a million things that we have to go right for them to even touch double digits. So, once again, but not, you know, no one was crazy enough to say that at this time Once again, we have to play the games, but for this game here, like I said, not an eight to move their ceiling. Bobby said seven and 10 to me. I want to split the difference and have a man and nine, which is working. They had last year. I think they have a little bit better talent this year other than the last year, so it's possible they can have a winning record. But you know, once again, there's so many things they have to break right for them to have a winning record. So I wouldn't be surprised if they went eight and nine again. So you know, bobby, your thoughts.
Bob Kelly:
Yeah, I mean eight and nine seems safe because, like you said, I mean they're they're absolutely serious 10 wins. There's no goddamn way in the world that this team wins 11 games. It's just not happening in this division especially with the addition of Aaron Rogers in there, Like that. You figure a successful division run for the Patriots is three and three Right. If they go three and three in the division it is beyond the success for what you can expect for the team. This is this upcoming season. On top of that, their schedule is probably one of the top five or six tougher schedules in the league. We've talked about that so many times on this show. So I honestly do think seven and 10 is way more realistic. But I'm definitely willing to go to eight and nine because I think it gives us that cushion, like you said. So eight and nine is fine with me, that's fine.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
So I'll say, I'll say one more time, mike, so we didn't get that down. So 13 and four, 11 and six, nine and eight, and then eight and nine.
Bob Kelly:
So the Jets no faking that.
Dave Clarke:
Patriots defense huh fellas.
Bob Kelly:
Yeah, that could be one beaters.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Yeah, no, I mean listen, the defense definitely is going to be the leader of the pack, that's for sure. It's just already going to continue to score. That's the thing.
Dave Clarke:
So I have an offensive coordinator now, though you didn't have one of those For sure, but it's like the offensive coordinator fixes some things.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
But you know we talked about earlier in the show about skiing, which is more about getting gas skimmed open and not necessarily running great routes like people had to before. But you still have to execute. So you have all the plays in the book. I equate a basketball you get a billion, you know a million dollar moves, but it's a jump shot Like you don't want to have. You know great field work or great plays being made, but guys can't get open. Guys don't know what it would be on the field. So we have to make sure that that's actually a thing. And who knows, even to you know just the cost of a blocking. You know, can you fucking block? For you know, magnus, whatever the fuck the quarterback spending, we have one on the roster.
Dave Clarke:
Well then you know who it's going to be. Steve Nail, you really narrowed it down, I guess. My question about the passes are they are they facing a personnel issue on offense or like an identity issue on offense, like I feel? Like, because I feel like Belichick, used to be able to take an offensive team that had guys on it that look like this type of offense. Yeah. I'll be it with Tom Brady behind the center. But, he would be able to take a team that look like this type of offense, looked exactly like this type of offense personnel-wise, and put points on the board and I just feel like that. That seems to have gone away and I'm just wondering is it a cultural?
Rayshawn Buchanan:
issue or no, it's not a personnel thing. I know people say I mean obviously the office online is something where you know the wide receivers, the biggest area?
Dave Clarke:
Well, no, but I mean listen, juju's gonna shoot their Kendrick Bourne, but that's my point, though, and like I feel like Juju Juju's the kind of wide receiver I wouldn't normally associate with a Belichick-led offense, and I feel like it's like are they going for a different identity this year? Like they might surprise us in that sense.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I mean maybe I mean they run along the RPOs in the preseason, so I think that's going to be a staple.
Bob Kelly:
Yeah, but then they cut the quarterback. Who ran those RPOs?
Rayshawn Buchanan:
No, but I mean, but no, I mean they're gonna. I mean obviously, I think you know when they were.
Bob Kelly:
Mac Jones ain't running an RPO, so I can tell you that.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Well, I mean, I don't expect him to break off, that's not happening. But I'm saying, like they're gonna run, that they didn't run Play Action at all, like that wasn't a thing last year, for whatever reason. They just did not run Play Action. They did it a lot the year before, but that's based off whatever Stevenson and Zeke are gonna do in the offense. So no, I wouldn't say as personal, I just think it's more so. The identity right now, like what exactly do you want to do? They can no longer be the communion offense where they would change their game plan for a week. They literally have to say, okay, at this point, here we're a run first team, like they did it in 2020. They said, look, we're just gonna run it down your throat, and they were a top five run offense. So they have more offense talent this year than they did in 2025.
Bob Kelly:
I gotta say Zeke looks skinny too. You got skinny Zeke, it's not a fat Zeke. Like the capo is not a fat Zeke, it's skinny Zeke, so that's good.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
We'll talk about that more throughout the year, but it's just like I'm just impainting. Guys just need to produce, so we could talk about coaching. I think Bella checked it.
Dave Clarke:
He did the classic Bella check thing, right. He was like just give me some guys and I'll paint with them. You know what I mean. Like give me some colors, I'll paint with them. Like I think year three obviously make or break for Mack Jones, right, like this is gonna be the year that everyone either buys all in or turns on him. Right, and you know They've already turned on him, but Sure, but I mean I don't mean like reactionary Twitter Patriots fans.
Bob Kelly:
I think this is like the world's gonna see this is for Bill too, right, I mean.
Dave Clarke:
No, he's got a lot of credit built up. I don't know if everybody he's won a lot of Super Bowl stuff.
Michael Marcangelo:
He's got 19 more wins. Okay, I'll under. Bob Kraft will not be the guy that let the greatest quarterback of all time go and the greatest coach.
Bob Kelly:
And the greatest coach. That's fair. That's fair, okay.
Dave Clarke:
He's got too much credit built up and, like I said, if you just let him see out the rest of his career on his own terms, you might get the day off work on the day on the anniversary of his death day. But I don't know, like I just what I would love to see and, like you know, I watched a large amount of Patriots games not every single one last season but what I would love to see is just a little bit more like confidence in Mack Jones. Like, I feel like they're trying to scheme around him all the time and they're trying to like paper over cracks or something. But like fuck it. Like run the Patriots offense and like let's see if he can do it. Like third down and four third down and four empty backfields. You know, like Mack Jones, like let's see, you know, and I just don't.
Michael Marcangelo:
They can't protect him. They can't protect him.
Bob Kelly:
And I wish they got him a guy. I wish they. I think that there's nothing that shows more confidence in your quarterback than going to get him a stud by receiver and paying good money to do it, because you know it'll take your offense to the next level, and they just didn't do that.
Dave Clarke:
They could have, they could have, they could have, they could have.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
He was right there, so I just don't understand that move oh yeah, they shoot, they shoot. The thing is that they should or they should not to do. But what I'm gonna say, we can move on, because I don't want to turn this into this, but we saw it. We saw it in his rookie year. Like we, just because it was so bad last year, we completely forget about 20-21, like that never happened. And it's like you know, the man threw 22 touchdowns, 10 picks, like that that's not awful. So it's a super solid rookie year, I mean that's a really bad.
Dave Clarke:
He was a pro bow quarterback technically Right, right, exactly.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
But he, he was. Why are you laughing?
Dave Clarke:
I mean, he was fucking in the pro bowl. Yeah, I just.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
He got in and, yeah, I get it, whatever it's the one that's messing with me, whatever, but I feel we've seen it. You know, granted, it was. It was, it was spread out, the game that he got hurt, the Baltimore game that was. That was looked like his signature game.
Bob Kelly:
Yeah, you posted that the other day. I saw that.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
And the game against Minnesota last year on Thanksgiving he was. He was ripping in the shreds. That was like this is what this is what it should look like. He's not gonna get 32 every week, but if you can get a proud two-fifty to two to two-eighty and we feel like you're in business so he's somewhere in between that, in my opinion. And just make enough plays where you give your team a chance, because once again you keep the guys off the field. You give those guys some rest. You should have a shot. But I said it has to have a consistent lead, not just every five or six weeks.
Dave Clarke:
You know I agree we should move on because it shouldn't be the Patriot Show. I just want to say one more thing about the AFCs. I think you guys are in a good spot to call this division order correctly if you go, because you're going Bill's, dolphins, jets, pats, right, and I think I think the one wild card for you here is I think I do have this theory about the dolphins that I think that Tua might have slept with someone's wife in the organization because they are not going to protect that man's brain from injury this year. Have you seen their offensive line in the preseason?
Bob Kelly:
It's so bad it's like a papier-mache offensive.
Dave Clarke:
So you have the most high profile concussion situation in the entire league happen to you, right, like the most high profile, talked about magnifying glass concussion situation on your team. You make a egregious error by putting them in harm's way when you shouldn't have and getting them fucking hurt again, right, and then it's like, ok, we're all done here, and then when you go back into the season, you just don't address it at all. In fact, you make your offensive line worse. I don't know what he did, but I don't even know if I want to watch dolphins games. I'm so worried about that man's health Like I really am. So, yeah, I agree with you on paper, if all goes according to plan, like if he's a normal quarterback that doesn't have like severe concussion issues, and like his doctors are probably begging him to retire, I think that even with that offensive line, I think that the skill positions and the talent that they have and the coaching that they have, I think they could definitely go 10, 11, 12.
Bob Kelly:
What's that? Could we actually so? I would actually say so the gap between jets and the dolphins. I think we should shrink that and honestly make that mirror each other. I think.
Dave Clarke:
Your picture locked in, bro. Your picture locked in, dude.
Bob Kelly:
It's too late I don't think they're my guard my guard.
Dave Clarke:
He typed it out. It's right here in front of me.
Michael Marcangelo:
And, by the way, and Ray said, and I put just so you get it one more time, mike, yeah, too late, too late, I mean honestly, what are we supposed to do?
Dave Clarke:
We can't change the rules for you. I mean, we're going to be halfway through the season. You're going to be like can I change the dolphins record? It's just, it doesn't work like that. We need to keep the integrity of the game going. Man, I'm sorry you know what, that's fine. Oh, that was a lot of fun, I really enjoyed doing that.
Michael Marcangelo:
Look at his face. Nsce style. I'm like. I he's wishing that the problem.
Bob Kelly:
Can we, can we use our steel already? Yeah, yeah, go ahead and use your, do your NFC.
Dave Clarke:
Philadelphia Eagles. You have the Eagles at five. I think that I have them at 13 and four. I could see them only losing three games, but I think that you're like, I think that I have the Eagles at 13 and four because I think that's what their record's going to be. You have them at 12 and five because you're hedging, and I think, I think, I want to go ahead.
Michael Marcangelo:
I have them at that because they get two new coordinators, cynics, new starters on offense and the toughest schedule by winning percentage in the league.
Dave Clarke:
But I think they're better than they were last year and they went to the Super Bowl last year. I think they improved their team.
Michael Marcangelo:
What were they? 15 and two last year. You think they're better than 15 and two?
Dave Clarke:
I don't know what their record's gonna be. I'm with you on the record and I know the changes and I know the strength of schedule. I'm saying that on paper their roster looks better Like. Their strength of schedule is very different and there's also a huge target on their back for the fact that they were essentially the best team last year, like I know that they lost to the Chiefs in the Super Bowl, but they were essentially on paper in the regular season, the best team statistically across the board, the best team, and I just think their roster has improved. I still have my doubts about Jalen Hertz as the guy. I think he's super talented, but I think we saw some things exploited last season. But I do think overall I think they made some really good roster additions, like Swift for instance. But I think that that's just like they're so fucking stacked in those areas and I just think it's gonna be a little scary.
Michael Marcangelo:
So you think it's more likely that they win 14 games as opposed to 11?
Dave Clarke:
No, no. What I was about to say was I think you're hedging and I think it's smart. I think 12 and five is a good hedge. I think I would be surprised if they only won 11 games. But what I could see happening because of the new coaching staff, because of the new stuff that's like that's coming in, because of the big fucking target on their back I could see them getting off to a rough start. Right, I could see them getting off to a rough start and then I could see them kind of dialing it back in. They're already wanting to know the plan to pass before they're already wanting to know. But that's the thing I mean, that's it. If you guys say that because that's your team and you're invested in this stuff like that's a banana skin game, Nobody wants to play the Pats for week one, you have no fucking idea what they're gonna do. You don't know how much tape that they've recorded on your defense, probably, and you just sorry, it's not nice.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I mean, it's a coping mechanism. I think we're gonna lose every game.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, yeah it is, you're absolutely right. But the thing is, when you look at it from the perspective of all of us who have had to watch Bill Belichick, you know coach football games to the last our whole lives. The fact of the matter is you don't wanna be playing the Pats week one. That's not your ideal week one game. It just isn't especially coming off a Super Bowl loss. And the other thing I'll say to you, mike, is I could see them only win in 10 or 11 games, because the Super Bowl hangover is a fucking real thing.
Bob Kelly:
The losing we say it every year. We say it every year.
Dave Clarke:
The losing team of the Super Bowl. It happens to everybody and except those really, really, really elite teams that say fuck that and come back and do it again. I think that in my head, on paper, I think that there's something to be said for those new coordinators and the sort of the fresh additions on the roster to try to curb that and eliminate that a little bit, and I think they are doing the right thing. So I don't think it's gonna be a full-blown hangover, but those first six games they all look potentially like slip-up. So I think it's a smart call 12 and five, unless we're gonna go crazy and say they are gonna have a full-blown Super Bowl hangover and call it nine and eight. I think that's gonna be a too long of an argument that we can have tonight, but I'm down. You wanna go fucking crazy. I'm not doing that. I'm always down to roll the dice, but yeah, I think.
Bob Kelly:
I'm down to have a nine and eight in Eagles argument. That sounds fun.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, do your steal. That'd be a great steal To be like fuck it, let's try and steal the Eagles, Okay. So yeah, let's go 12 and five for the Eagles. Let's talk about Robert Kelly's Dallas Cowboys. That's low, bro. Nine and eight is low. That's fucking low. They've got the best defense in the NFL, bro. They do. They sure do. For the record, this is our biggest, like most far away record. I said 12 and five, Mike said nine and eight, and I honestly think he's just doing it to be a fucking asshole to you.
Michael Marcangelo:
I really know. Yeah, that's no. All right, I think they have the best defense.
Bob Kelly:
They're better than they were last year. By far they're better.
Michael Marcangelo:
Bobby, you said they had the best skill position at Emily last year. How wrong were you so like?
Dave Clarke:
you're never gonna die with that one buddy.
Michael Marcangelo:
Ever, ever, ever. The big thing for me is my quick part, the offense of play color. For the first time in six years, the last time he was a play color for the Packers with the greatest quarter, one of the greatest quarterbackings of all time.
Dave Clarke:
Oh, I wouldn't go that fucking far. Jesus Christ, I'm the fucking breaks on that one. He got one Super Bowl ring he can go fuck himself. One of them would be the ball time Get out of here they went seven and nine.
Michael Marcangelo:
So I think he, I think he's a terrible play color, I think that they got better on the field, Bobby, but I think their coaching got worse on offense. I think the owner, Jerry you know this already playing fucking mind games with Dak by bringing in Trey, by bringing in Trey, Lance. So fucking stupid, didn't even consult with the coach or with the quarterback, and the quarterback again has a bit of a cousins. I think that it's more likely that they win 10 games. I just don't think that they're gonna win a letter. I don't. They have the second hardest schedule in the league, aside from the Eagles, and I didn't be able to stack.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, listen, here's the thing, Mike McCarthy. I mean all your points are salient and well explained and you are always eloquent, despite the bullshit coming out of your mouth, but you are always eloquent and well spoken. But Mike McCarthy, like this is. I love how you cherry pick stuff, like Mike McCarthy the last time he was a play caller where, like the Packers, went with one of the greatest quarterbacks of all time, I'm sure, just to enhance your argument, like you're so shamed the same guy that he's been shitting his life on for the last five years.
Bob Kelly:
Here's the thing.
Dave Clarke:
Sure, the reason that that play calling thing happened in Green Bay is because Aaron Rodgers decided before that season he was gonna throw his he fit and get Mike McCarthy thrown out of that organization. I think that that's a well known fact, right? Secondly, it's not that I think Mike McCarthy is like a great coach, but I think a new play caller was exactly what that team needed. And I think I'd like to believe I'd like to believe that Mike McCarthy sees and hopefully can convince his guy what it's gonna take to win games for this currently constituted Dallas Cowboys team, which is don't turn the ball over. Don't turn the ball over on offense right. Hold the ball on offense. Time of possession. This is this is how I would do it, and you know for what it's worth, mike, if you're listening, not you, mike McCarthy. Time of possession. I think that defense is so good. I think it's one of the best defenses we've seen in the last decade. I think they're gonna be an incredible, incredibly fun walk. I think that there's a weight of the Jersey issue with the Dallas Cowboys, where you know they have this sort of franchise luck that we all revel in sort of enjoying over the course of the season, especially since we have Bobby here to like, actually like, embody the pain, and that does make me happy, don't get me wrong. But the fact of the matter is, if you ask me, what do Dallas Cowboys need to be have a successful regular season, which is what we're talking about here, the first thing I would have said to you was a new play caller. It would have been the first thing out of my mouth. I would have said a couple of roster improvements on the depth in the defensive side of the ball, which they did and get rid of Zeke. Those would have been the three things I said that you would have needed to make a decent run at a regular season record of what I call 12 and five. Right, they did all three of those things. So for me, how many games they won last year? 13?, 11, 11, 11. Right, so they didn't get worse. Right Like they didn't get worse. And what you're saying is that Mike McCarthy, head coach in the NFL, is so inept at the call of twins.
Michael Marcangelo:
What I'm saying is is that the Eagles and the Giants, the better it's not what you say.
Dave Clarke:
I don't think that the Giants got better. I don't think that the Giants got better.
Michael Marcangelo:
They're way better way better.
Dave Clarke:
I don't know. I think they're going to fall off. Listen, I'll make you a deal. I called the Cowboys at 12 and five. You called the Cowboys at nine and eight, All right. I'll give you 10 and seven. I'll give you 10 and seven on him.
Bob Kelly:
I'll take it.
Dave Clarke:
I'll take it man. I'm sorry Bob. I really think he did this just to fuck with you, Can we?
Bob Kelly:
steal Right, you want to steal that.
Dave Clarke:
Well, it's not really a steal. You just get to also make a record prediction for this, for this division, if you want, and if you're right, then you get the points the whole division or just the.
Bob Kelly:
Cowboys.
Dave Clarke:
No, you get to, you know, just one team for the whole conference. So you get to pick one team in our conference that you get to make a division selection for. You want to you.
Bob Kelly:
want to hold it and discuss at the end? Yeah, let's wait, all right.
Dave Clarke:
I think you're high on the Giants.
Michael Marcangelo:
I want to play after you my shirt, and, and there is a division with the best team in the NFL Like. I don't know man. So the Cowboys you just try to get, you just try to, but they're really good.
Dave Clarke:
They're really good. I don't think the Giants are good.
Michael Marcangelo:
The Giants won the Giants on the playoff game last year. The Cowboys didn't.
Dave Clarke:
What was the record going in? Then they get into the playoffs with a losing record.
Michael Marcangelo:
So they were? I think they were not an eight, all right, fuck it.
Dave Clarke:
Nine and eight again. I mean I'm not.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I don't think that they're going to Giants, giants, what's kind of seven last year, all right.
Michael Marcangelo:
So I then I'm saying that the the rest of the division go better. And now they're not an eight. I still think 10, seven possible. I don't know how.
Dave Clarke:
Boys, week one, 49ers. Week three Seahawks, dolphin Bills, jets, cowboys again, I don't know man. Philadelphia Eagles 16 and 18,. Their last three games are tough. I had dude. I don't know man, I don't know. I really feel like we got a week. I think. I think they're going to win eight games. Can we just give them eight and then you have your own? You have your nine wins.
Michael Marcangelo:
Because I don't, I don't, I don't think they're going to win center.
Dave Clarke:
OK, let's just do this really quick, and I'm sorry for the other team. I have their schedule pulled up in front of me. I just want you to say win or loss as I go through it. Ok, and if we can get to, if we can get to your 10 wins, we'll say 10 wins. All right, I have nine. I said nine, fine Nine. I thought I thought someone said 10 just now.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I said they won 10 last year.
Dave Clarke:
They went 10 last year, but don't you think they got better this year, mike? I thought you said they got better. All right, doesn't matter, dallas, when, sweet Jesus, this is already a farce, it's all yeah, it's no, no, no.
Michael Marcangelo:
The Cowboys historically do not start the season well.
Dave Clarke:
That's why, bobby goes into a panic in September.
Michael Marcangelo:
Fine.
Dave Clarke:
Cardinals when two and oh Forty Niners loss two and one. Seahawks when. Well, where is it In New York?
Michael Marcangelo:
When Dolphins.
Dave Clarke:
I'll say loss 3 and 2. Bills Loss 3 and 3. Commanders win 4 and 3. Jets I thought he was the greatest quarterback of all time a second ago. No, no, no, you said that I didn't. I quoted you. You said one of the greatest quarterbacks ever.
Michael Marcangelo:
To quote you, I didn't say that you said it 55 minutes ago when I was talking about the Packers.
Dave Clarke:
No well, I was probably just trying to help my argument. Okay, so fine. 5 and 4. Or 5 and 3? 5 and 3. Raiders Win, 6 and 3. Cowboys Loss. In. Dallas 6 and 4. In Washington, with the commanders All right, 7 and 4. New England at home Win 8 and 4. 5 week Packers Loss, wow, I don't understand football.
Michael Marcangelo:
What's happening?
Dave Clarke:
right now, 9 and 5. They beat Green Bay, though they don't lose to them. No, I don't think so either. But whatever it washes out, because I think they win the first game Saints in New Orleans Loss 9 and 6. In Philadelphia with the Eagles Loss 9 and 7. And then the Eagles, and then the Rams and the Eagles again. I think I miscounted. All right, well, we got you 9 wins, whatever, All right, 9 and 8. 9 and 8.
Michael Marcangelo:
Perfect, now I like the commanders. I like the commanders in the sense that they have that, they have. I think he's a really, really really good coach.
Dave Clarke:
You know they play the Eagles week 18, and I think the Eagles might be resting their starters by that point, so that could be a win.
Bob Kelly:
You know, some teams have to be bad, though right, there has to be some bad teams.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I know that's why I was like every, every. It's not going to go according to plan and that was gotta be bad.
Michael Marcangelo:
We got to start. I had. I mean we have the commanders at 6 and 11, but I won't do a five and 12.
Dave Clarke:
Is that? Is that the next team? Is that the last team? Yep, last team. You had 6 and 11. I had five and 12.
Michael Marcangelo:
Yeah, I want to go five and 12.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, yeah, I could see him winning four games, but I I don't know if I could see him winning six, to be honest with you. But yeah, that's fine, they're definitely not winning seven. They're definitely not winning seven, right? So that's fine. Five and 12, at least we're agreed there. I also think that we should lock in this division for us. Well, it's just a team, it's one, one team's record locked.
Michael Marcangelo:
We should lock in Philly. Okay, we can walk in.
Bob Kelly:
Oh no, that just happens automatically. The order part right.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, yeah, your order is your order. I don't know if I I don't know if I want to lock in Philly man. We had that whole super bowl conversation hangover. Super bowl, super bowl, hangover conversation.
Michael Marcangelo:
Okay, well, I don't. We weren't really sure on the, on the.
Dave Clarke:
I'm not sure of any of this.
Michael Marcangelo:
Okay, this is my first time the NFC, then that's also not sure. You were on Bobby and my team the first year I remember you said I'm dropping my secret about pastic right on Bobby. Oh my God For the Lions. That's true, I can't remember this.
Dave Clarke:
I can't remember what I have for breakfast, but that's fine, I I'm not. I'm not good at this. Okay, all right, I think I think we should hold off on the lock. Let's talk about our locks at the end, but we'll put a pin in the Eagles, if that's cool with you. Okay, jesus Christ. The who's up next? The AFC West.
Bob Kelly:
Are we on the West already? All right.
Dave Clarke:
That's your last division, yeah.
Bob Kelly:
Okay, all right, so this one. We were pretty on point here, except for one we were a little off on, but I'll just start with mine.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
So I, broncos, I'm getting past this one. What I won? A decade against this one, yeah.
Bob Kelly:
Broncos six and 11, raider six and 11, Chargers 10 and seven, chiefs 15 and two. I just think this division you know last year I got cute with this division, did the Broncos just did the Raid?
Dave Clarke:
did Raid think the Broncos are going to win a lot of more games?
Bob Kelly:
Yes, he does.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I got it right. I got to go down with the ship man. Oh, of course, oh my.
Dave Clarke:
God, I wouldn't have anything else, let's ride, let's ride. Broncos touched right then let's ride. Yeah, I don't ever die.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I got never won eight games, though Like it didn't happen, yeah, I mean.
Bob Kelly:
So I do want to talk about the division too, because I think this, this, this, this, Ray, I think this and the Bangles is our two locks, because the, the Bangles and the Chiefs are the two best teams in the AFC and I don't think there's anyone really close to them. The bills are there, but Barrow and Mahomes are so much more superior to Allen at this point and I think they've both proven that. We talked about that at at at lengths in the power ranking show. We think those two are just above Allen when it comes to everything they've proven so far. But the rest of the division I just think you know everyone likes to get cute every year and like not pick the Chiefs to be the best team and like think that someone's going to come and see them.
Dave Clarke:
Everyone, bro, it just feels like that's the sign above your head, with an arrow pointing to you Everyone.
Bob Kelly:
It was just you, um, not this year, not this year. I've, I've, I've. I've worn my lesson personally and the Chiefs are the best team in the NFL, until someone shows me differently. Uh, it's, it's, it's, yeah, chiefs the best team. But, ray, I want you to make your Broncos argument here, because I just don't see it, man, I know.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I would say like Russ is so washed man he's so. Listen, I listen. I like me and DK got into one of our biggest arguments over that Like in the show, like for the first one was like over, like, yeah, it's like. I think I think I'm not a dinosaur. It was a candy a few years ago, that was a great one. But yeah, I was, I was on, I was on the hype train big time. I just, I just think it was a, it was a coach that they were hacking, it was a must hack it. Um, honestly, I'm just like yo Sharpe. You got something to prove you. You came in talking crazy about the privilege regime, so you better come in there and coach your ass off. So I'm thinking just for that alone.
Dave Clarke:
One second, one second, one second. Where was the lie?
Rayshawn Buchanan:
No, no, where was the lie?
Dave Clarke:
You didn't lie, but I'm saying I didn't say a fucking word of anything that was not true about that previous.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I'm, when you come in, talking that crazy you, you better come in, you know, with you know doing, doing a hell of a job.
Bob Kelly:
So it comes in dropping dong anyway, so you know he's also.
Dave Clarke:
I mean here's, here's the Sean Peyton tried and true method. He's going to come in and he's going to make sure that those defensive players are fired up to get their bonuses, to hurt the other opposition.
Bob Kelly:
So there's Greg Williams, the secret advisor. Here's the plan guys. We're going to target offensive players.
Dave Clarke:
but do me a favor, Don't talk about it on tape this time.
Bob Kelly:
Yeah, let's not talk about it yeah.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
That's why I got they wins, because I'm like they're going to come in. John Payne is a fucking savage dude.
Dave Clarke:
He's a fucking savage. I could see it. I honestly could see it.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Yeah, I'm here for it. So yeah, I'll give you seven.
Bob Kelly:
I'll give you seven. I'll give you seven. I can go with seven and 10. I don't think I can go higher than that, because I don't see them being about 500. I don't see it, man.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Yeah, this, this, this. Listen, this is all about my personal agenda at this moment. But, yeah, fine, I'll go with the seven to 10 and find with that, but I'd be totally happy to lose this one. Could I Like my personal agenda but?
Bob Kelly:
like, yeah, the only other one is charges. Could you, could you see them going to 11 or 12? Could you see 12 as the ceiling, I think I think they lose both.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I think they lose twice to Kansas City.
Bob Kelly:
Yeah, okay, so we'll keep them at 10 and seven, just to keep it safe and keep that a while.
Dave Clarke:
Okay, raiders, raiders, they're still their coach. Right, the Chargers? Yeah, they're fucked.
Bob Kelly:
Exactly so. It's funny, you said I think everyone who is listening probably had this thought. You said earlier that teams with talent whose coaches make the bad decisions that bring them down.
Dave Clarke:
That's what I was thinking of, every single person.
Bob Kelly:
Yeah, every single person who's ever listened to this podcast will think of Brandon Staley.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
You know what's crazy, though? He's not even that big a hurdle and that's wild to say but it is December, football and injuries. That's the biggest hurdle. There is no one that plays better from September to November than the Chargers I don't care who's been there, fluity Rivers, whoever, they play really well from September to November. December comes and they forget what the hell's going on. That's coaching, yeah.
Dave Clarke:
I'm still a full on believer in Herbert. I think he's still has the potential to be a top five quarterback in this league. I really do. But yeah, I think he's got the brains, I think he's got the arm. I just think he needs to fucking coach to be honest with you. So fair enough. The one thing I'll also say about your Broncos prediction guys is, like, all that being said, with the Peyton, the Champagne stuff, there are two contradicting ideas. One is it wasn't the Russell looked like wash, necessarily, he just looked like he didn't give a fuck, like he just looked like he didn't care, like to be there, and I think that that could be solved by Sean Peyton. Like I think he could come in and be like yo, you see what I fucking did with your breeze for like this amount of years. That was all me. Drew sucked. I made him great Like whatever the fucking pitches. You know what I mean. Like I don't know. But also I've seen bad Broncos teams have winning home records. It's hard to go to my high, it just is. So you know, I would. I don't think it's bad to be a little higher on those. I'm not trying to influence your picks, but I don't. I don't think it's a terrible.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
It's you know. You don't have to influence me, baby, I know.
Dave Clarke:
I don't think the thing is they can only get better because they were laughably. Yeah, they were laughably bad.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Yeah, listen, I mean before I would say I'm sorry.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, no, but they only get better. It's just, I didn't know, and none of us knew that Russell Wilson was a weird guy. That's just like what sort of came out during that whole transition. So I don't know if he can win over his teammates of champagne and get them playing Dangerous.
Michael Marcangelo:
You guys think that the Raiders are going to be 6-11 just because of the division they play in, or do you think that they're worse?
Dave Clarke:
Talk about a team that's going to be good for the first three months Fucking Jimmy G Baby before he goes down. He's going to be like, yeah, we are, that's what.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
I'm saying and you're going to take over for the yeah it's a division, like someone. Someone has to get the brunt of, someone has to be bad. Yeah, so someone has to be the leader for teams. I just think it's going to be there so crazy. And I could be healthy enough. Once again, I love Josh Jacobs. I love the box, the atoms. I don't see it.
Dave Clarke:
Michael and I are going to use our steel. They have a bad defense too.
Bob Kelly:
It's a tough division to have a bad defense.
Michael Marcangelo:
Before you let them know about that DK. So just to be clear your final order is the chiefs and 15 to the charters and 10 and 7. The Broncos and 7 and 10 and the Raiders and 6 and 11.
Bob Kelly:
That's correct. Yes, Great.
Michael Marcangelo:
So we're going to use our steel and we're going to say that the Kansas City Chiefs will finish 13 and 4.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
That's it Okay.
Dave Clarke:
Cool, now, just so that. Just so we're clear on the steel rules. If they, if you guys are calling them 15 and we're calling them 13 wins, if they get 14 wins, we win, we win. Yes, yeah, you say that. Yeah, but I just want to reiterate it. So when you guys are considering who you're going to steal, like that factors in, because, like we're.
Bob Kelly:
We actually already have our, so we're ready to use ours if you want.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, fuck it, hit me.
Bob Kelly:
I'm going to use the Vikings and we're going to say they're going to be. What do you think right? 10 and 7?
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Yep. So yeah, let's go, so good.
Bob Kelly:
I just don't see the drop off being as catastrophic as you guys do. If you're taking out I know the Lions and Bears got better, but you guys already said it you're taking out one of the top 10 quarterbacks and the NFL and putting them in a completely separate conference, and this is a team that won 13 games last year. I think dropping all the way to seven is a catastrophic drop off. I just don't see it.
Dave Clarke:
I mean, it's literally the catastrophic drop off that happens to every inflated regular season team. But all right, like may the best man win. All right, the NFC West.
Michael Marcangelo:
I mean it's, it was just, I think none.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, I think we're pretty close here, mike right.
Michael Marcangelo:
So I had? I had Sam Sprann at 12 and 5. Yeah, I had Seattle at 10 and 7. Yeah, the Rams at 7 and 10. Yeah, and then the Cardinals at 2 and 15.
Dave Clarke:
Okay, Right off the bat, I'm going to give you the Cardinals at 2 and 15. I had them at 3 and 14, but they're fucking terrible and I mean we want to be terrible too.
Bob Kelly:
Winning one, winning one game. Want to be bad yeah.
Dave Clarke:
Winning one game isn't entirely out of the realm of possibility, to be totally honest with you. I mean, kyler is just going to be on ice for at least six weeks, right? Because they didn't, right? So that means he has to be out for like the first six, right?
Michael Marcangelo:
And not that he's the second, not that he's the second coming or Christ or anything. But they also just released Colt McCoy and the reason they did that is because he's three and three is last six starts. They don't want to win games, they are in full on tank mode.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, as they should be. They were kind of fun to watch the Deandre Kyler connection for a second there. I don't think that they were ever. I nobody thought that they were ever going to like do anything.
Bob Kelly:
They were like remember that one. They were like 10 and one at one point or like 10 and oh, going into Green Bay I think two years ago and it's just never.
Dave Clarke:
I think we all knew that was a little inflated too, but I think I am a little higher on Kyler than the majority, I think, of the NFL fan base. I know that people knock his height. I know that they. It's frustrating, I'm sure, if you're Cardinals fan, to watch him like throw across his body outside the pocket a bunch. Donovan McNabb did that and used to complete passes, so I was there. But the yeah, I mean I don't know. I think that they're doing the right thing for the organization right now Keep Kyler on ice, lose, go, go get some players, go get some picks. You know, figure it out, start over, because, like once you lose the Andres, you know that's what you got to do. So let's just chalk it up to that. Right, I had three or 14. You had two and 15. Let's just go with you Two and 15. I could see it. The Rams we both said seven and 10, I believe. Right, yeah, so yeah, I think makes sense. I think that they had, like we talked about the Super Bowl hangover, the, the Baker Mayfields, that's the thing you know. Like all this whole mess of like things that have happened. Alan Robinson didn't work out there. He was pretty much watched by the time he showed up there and he was supposed to be like their kind of big wide receiver. I don't think that they're that good. I think that there's still some guys from that Super Bowl team that are like decent personnel and I think that I could see them win an eight if a really, really high year I would. If you wanted to go down to six and 11, I could. I could definitely justify it, but I'm OK to just say seven and 10 if you are.
Michael Marcangelo:
Yeah, I just you factor in the fact that Aaron Donald Stafford and Cooper Cup Misty combined like 22 games last year. As long as I do that again this year, they're going to be better.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, I mean it's tough, though right, Because Cooper Cup literally gets the ball thrown in his direction on every single fucking play and it's like that's not a great way to keep your wide receiver healthy, you know, like he's the only thing they have. So and he's really good. Don't get me wrong, but I didn't want to draft him in that he was like on the board in our fantasy board for and like top six. And I didn't want him for that reason, because it's just like I don't see him last in the whole season. But yeah, ok, that's fine. Seven wins All right, so Seahawks. I'm a little higher on the Seahawks. I think that they've kind of I think they've kind of got in their act together. They still have DK Metcalf Maybe I'm higher on Gino than you are Is that, is that where we're at. I know that they're not going to have like a deep game Like I know that they don't really match up on paper. I know that, like Gino Smith and fucking DK Metcalf aren't like the match, aren't like a match made in heaven stylistically, but they still have a lot of talented players. I think that they still have a. I think they have a top three coach. I think they have a top three worst places to go and play. You know, I think they could win 11 games potentially. I think they could. Yeah, ok, 10. Yeah, 10 and 12. No, I think you're right, they're definitely not going to win 13. So calling them 12 would be too much. Let's say 10 and 7. That means they could win 9 or they could win 11. I'll take it. And then, lastly, but certainly not leastly, I'm a little lower on the 49ers, just because of their reaction to that playoff loss and I know it's not the hugest thing in the world, but like they were such fucking babies about how they fucking got knocked out. They were like we're gonna fuck it's like I don't think they're gonna pull out the same sort of miracles they pulled off personnel wise last year where it's like you have like five injuries at one position and like everyone's still good. That was insane. I don't. I don't see that happening again. What do you think about them?
Michael Marcangelo:
moving on from tree Lance, like a hundred percent, even third overall pick, like that was the worst trade out that they like if they ever did, and that was probably the Biggest, if it were me, I would I wait, but if it were me, I want to keep them there, just just in case you know.
Bob Kelly:
There, there, where it wasn't like a one-off, like crazy season, you really got a lot of faith and party to make that move right.
Michael Marcangelo:
That's what I'm saying, yeah but also, like nobody hates quarterbacks more than Well he loves running backs.
Dave Clarke:
I don't know if he hates once. You loves running backs and he makes. He makes five good running backs appear out of fucking nowhere every season. So I mean he's and I and I think he's a top coach. I really do, I think he's one of the best coaches, for sure, but Underrated, criminally underrated coach, if you ask me.
Michael Marcangelo:
But and they they added Javan Hargrave to that defense. That was number one in the league last year. Like they're, they're gonna be, I Think that obviously they're gonna be top.
Dave Clarke:
I do. Here's my worry about their defense. Here's my worry about their defense because I drafted defense. I was the first person to drop. Defense are fancily and I took the Cowboys instead of the four-in-a-ters. Here's why consistency over a league season Comes down to being good in every defensive position. I think that there's two types of defenses you can have. I think you can have a defense where you have a bunch of decent guys and then you have like three or four game changers. And then you have a defense where you have one game changer, maybe two, and then you have a bunch of really good guys, and I think the Cowboys are the latter and the, the 49ers are the former. I think that they have like more studs like across the, across their defensive field, but I think that that means any injury. Any bossa coming up on a ticker With with a, with the word weeks next to it, is a fucking disaster for the 49ers, like a real disaster for them defensively. I think that they have. I Don't think that that'll happen. You know, I think that those guys are historically like very durable and like they, I think they have like a good, durable defense. But that's just my worry with them.
Michael Marcangelo:
So let me just ask you what's more likely that they win 13 years at the same time, I think.
Dave Clarke:
I. It's a fair question and I think, just because of their division, I think I'll go with. It's more likely that they win 13 games and they win 10. So fine, let's go with, let's go with 12 and yeah, okay, yeah makes sense. Gentlemen, good picking. We have some housekeeping to do at the end here, because we're gonna call our oh.
Bob Kelly:
Your steel? Did you steal? Yes, yeah.
Dave Clarke:
And let's talk about our locks so it means, if it's 9 or 11, we get it correct correct, but we're way lower on the biking, so you don't even have to worry about our record with them. I don't think yeah but Okay, tell us your lock guys so, ray, I'm gonna pitch to you.
Bob Kelly:
So I'm between chiefs of the Bengals Chiefs at 15. I know it's very, very, very high but again, and I think that they are by far away the best team in the league this year. I know they have to target on their back but they've already proven to us that they can take that. I Don't think it's out of the realm of possibility, because we saw the Eagles do it last year to get to that 15 point and again they only have to get the 14 in that division that they're in, where they're by far away the best team. The other one I'll pitch to you is the Bengals, again by far and away the best team in their division, and I think this is the Joe Barrow season. We'll get to that more in a little bit, but I think this is the year oh Barrow. So those are my two pitches to you.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Yeah, I mean, you know we talked a little bit about it earlier. So I'm I'm leaning towards, bro. I mean no reason why now we said 15 and 2 because of how Crazy can city can get offensively and they're part of law most teams, but they may be resting people by, and you know, week 16. So, um, they may not get to that. So I'd lean towards Cincinnati in this case and you like bangles, walking in bangles.
Dave Clarke:
Cruel summer locking in the bangles.
Bob Kelly:
Who would have seen the day that we're locking in the bangles at 13 goddamn wins?
Dave Clarke:
According to the swift at that, I think that we initially had talked about locking in the Eagles. Mike, funny enough, I had a pitch to you that I was just about to make where I was looking at all you. You, very graciously, and thank you for doing all the writing down of this stuff Sent me all these records that we've locked in and I just couldn't get my eyes off that Cardinals record. That's that is gonna be the fucking lock, isn't it?
Bob Kelly:
It has to be. What's there?
Dave Clarke:
They're telling us that that's a lock. You know so. And then Mike messaged me on the side. He was like lock Cardinals. And I just had the thought. So the serendipity of it, it's so fucking beautiful that I think we have to. The Cardinals will be locked for the AFC team and I think we should get the points now, to be honest with you, but we'll wait. Okay, we have a few other things to do. Guys, this was, this was a lot of fun. Your orders are locked. Your records are locked. Your locks are locked. Call out arrival.
Michael Marcangelo:
We've taken the Kansas City Chiefs from one time out did we lock the division. Yet what do you mean?
Dave Clarke:
Like that happens of it. Oh, they're just yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, cuz the orders the order right, because they're their records are gonna dictate the order we called the Kansas City Chiefs is our rival lock. You guys called the Minnesota Vikings is your rival lock. Who is going to be your NFL MVP, gentlemen?
Bob Kelly:
All right. So do we go chalk or Do we pick? Do we go with what? My second pitch was man, you decide on this. So I said the Ray earlier. Obviously, the chalk pick here is my homes. Yeah, it's, it's obvious. Picked that everyone's thinking that we should make, everyone's thinking that we're probably gonna make. But I pitched Joe Borough. Man, I think this is the year of borrow like. I just said. I think this is Joe's year to show that he is on the same level of my homes and if it's gonna happen, it's gonna be this year, after everything that happened last year, where you know, he said that this is, you know, joe borrows house. He went into Arrowhead, he said it was borough head and then they lost. So I think he has a lot more to prove this year. So, if I have it my way, I would say Joe borough leisure NFL MVP it. However, that depends on his house, so I don't know what his health is looking like going into the beginning of the season. Last I heard he was gonna play, so if that's different, okay, correct me if I'm wrong here, but I think this is the year of borrow. Yeah, he's healthy going in the week one, correct, guys?
Rayshawn Buchanan:
This is this is a. This is he'll play part 2.0. Let's, let's, let's, let's rock where I'm going with it. Yeah, so I can. Baby, let's get it, you're going with it, I'm gonna get it. I'm a big fan. I'm a big fan of his game. He's only one that can the throne fishing. In my opinion, in all of football and I've just, and they have see, so you know, the Mahomes pictures just isn't fun. It's like okay, go, no, I mean.
Bob Kelly:
I'm home to get for MVP.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
That's the best thing in the league Once again you see, you know, just for the record, you don't get any points for making a more fun prediction of just putting that out there.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah right, no, it's the same thing like in those sports, like we know, like all the time he was playing.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
We know that, you know we're wrong. But Ron should win, right. But like you know, it's like Jordan should win every year.
Bob Kelly:
So it's just like, yeah, that's cool.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
But there's others are deserving players that you know deserve that nod. So in this case here, it's not like we're picking, you know fucking. Yeah, I think so. When doing you know MVP, you know we're, you know we're picking Joe Burrow. Like this guy is a problem. No, so yeah, joe Burrow, it is, we're in the league no.
Bob Kelly:
So yeah, joe Burrow, it is, we're in MVP baby.
Michael Marcangelo:
All right, so I know that we don't points for game the most fun pick, but I picked for the NFL MVP this year as a man that about to be the first 4,000 yard passer in his team's history, and if he does that, he'll probably become the first NFL player to rush for a thousand yards while throwing for 4,000. And that's just the deals.
Dave Clarke:
Yes, that's what I was gonna say. Fuck, yes, yes, yes, I was full on gonna make that pitch to you. I lock it in, fucking, lock it in, absolutely fucking Lulee, lock it in. I was out, I had a whole thing prepared. I had a whole thing prepared and I didn't even have to talk you into it. I had a whole speech about his odds, about everything, about DJ more, and I don't even have to make the fucking speech. Look that shit in. You don't get any more points for making a phone call, but guess what you get? Get him from making the correct call on the best fucking player in the end of fucking Justin Field. I can't fuck you. I might wake all. All of that, oh, I don't even know what to do with myself now. What happens next? What's the rest of the show? When you said also rushing, I was like yes, oh, oh, my god, I am.
Bob Kelly:
Wow, okay, as a boner.
Dave Clarke:
No, no, you'd be able to see it.
Bob Kelly:
So the.
Dave Clarke:
Fact of the matter is you guys picked Joe Burrow, we picked Justin Fields and it was probably gonna be tragic with homes. No one's gonna get that point. And yeah, we've called the MVP rookie of the year. We're gonna go first on this one, since you guys got MVP. If you're okay with that, that's fine Good. I would like the Atlanta Falcons running back.
Michael Marcangelo:
That's my best.
Dave Clarke:
Okay, great, we're done. Go ahead guys.
Bob Kelly:
That's all I.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Know. You know, because I know, I know we're me about each other before the federal player the year.
Bob Kelly:
So I'm I got another one for you. He's replacing the Andre Swift's and Jamal Williams in Detroit, that's your mayor games.
Dave Clarke:
Oh yeah, we're gonna go in a mirror game. It's gonna be nice.
Bob Kelly:
He was. He was 1.02 and everyone's dynasty football draft, so I feel like it's the only other pick we can make it this far oh. Okay, great B-zone is definitely the pick, though that guy's a fucking beast.
Dave Clarke:
He's so fucking good. I can't wait to watch him. All right, defensive player of the year. Your guys this turn. We went first on rookie of the year, so please go, thank God. Probably probably take Michael Parsons, I would imagine. Yeah, you did this guy right this guy right here.
Bob Kelly:
It blocked that. Shit it he. He's already said he's moving more to the edge this year, which means that sack number is gonna go way up. I'm predicting maybe 19 to 20 sacks for Michael this year. Michael Parsons, DP. Oh I.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Also Michael shreyham Bruce Smith love, oh yeah.
Bob Kelly:
Oh yeah, mike is gonna be a beast. This year's watch out quarterbacks need to be where it's a good, it's probably the.
Dave Clarke:
It's probably I haven't looked at the odds, but I would imagine it probably is that the lowest odds to bet on on Parsons Mike, but I'm her boss, I would say right. No, I probably say my pick is probably the next odds. And, mike, you know, feel free to talk me out of it, but Miles Garrett.
Michael Marcangelo:
Hmm, I was in it. I was gonna say that, or sauce gardener. I just think that this is gonna be a really big year for for him. I think he showed how just how electric he was last year.
Dave Clarke:
What year? What year is he going into what? How many you get to your second year?
Rayshawn Buchanan:
That's tough bro Second year sophomore slope.
Michael Marcangelo:
Didn't Mike? Did Mike a person have a sophomore slope?
Dave Clarke:
No, it happens to everybody, but it is like you know he's, he's, he's. He's the real deal, though I feel like TJ want Nick Bosa, like. These are guys that I think are more likely before sauce gardener. To be honest, I feel like linebackers and edge rushers just have the edge on getting defensive player the year because they have those, but then I also know that you don't.
Michael Marcangelo:
You know so my actually know my two picks were sauce gardener and then Brian burns from the Panthers. But you already only kind of mixed me on the on on the Panthers thing.
Dave Clarke:
No, I mean he's an edge rusher right Like he's a he's. He's pretty lethal. He hit 12 and a half sides last year.
Michael Marcangelo:
He's 25. And I just think that that team would be only with that. Teams in a to do well is is to excel on defense.
Dave Clarke:
So like that would be my cheap pictures, but I'm okay with whoever you think, all right, I mean I'm okay with, I'm okay with Brian burns over sauce gardener. To be honest, I'm going to eat my fucking words if sauce gardener wins the play of the year. But I will just pitch this to you, just based on the on the Vegas book, if this makes any sense. Mike is at plus 600. Nobody's got good odds. Obviously it's a tough call. Mike is a plus 600. He's the, he's the favorite. Miles Garrett is plus 750. Tj Watts, plus a 50, boasts plus 1200 and then it's drop off after that. Brian burns is plus 3000. So because we're just getting a point, we're not getting like odds paid back. I I would be more inclined to go with either miles, tj or Nick, but I I I'd like to just take miles Garrett because I think I gave you a lot of the records. I think I was, I think I was pretty, I think I cat out on the record.
Michael Marcangelo:
So let's just get it, just based on the odds. Speaker of the house. Stick right there. No, no, no, I'm not going to get anything like that, nothing like that, nothing like that.
Dave Clarke:
We need to stop talking about my dick. That's the second mention of my dick on the show. I mean, I know you guys got it on the brain, but like, come on, I'm only one minute, okay, wonderful.
Bob Kelly:
Is that everyone? Is it everything? It is.
Dave Clarke:
We have to call first coach fired. I don't think that there's any sort of huge likelihood here. I think there's like three or four good candidates, but you guys go ahead first If you're, if you're.
Bob Kelly:
I got. I got one. We already brought him up on the show once and that's Dennis Allen of the New Orleans Saints. Um, I think it was a surprise that he was even brought back this year and I think it's very possible. I for all the teams that have some kind of expectation going into this year, I could see the Saints bottoming out so fast. You know, derek Carr has already proven that he can be weak when it comes down to the points where you know it's make or break. You know, last year with the Oakland when he got benched it was a whole thing, or Vegas, I guess now it was a whole thing, um, and I just know he was already on the hot seat and I could see them starting out. You know, oh and three, oh and four. And then, all of a sudden, it's the world's on fire in New Orleans and Dennis Allen's going to be the guy to get the ax first. That's my pitch.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
It was funny Like that, though, like he, I love his answer at the pro bowl. I don't know if you guys saw that clip where. I did see that yeah. Frank, start with asking him about it and he was. He was throwing like 60 yards and on one of the little games that were having, and you know, he said something about staying hot and he was just like, yeah, well, if I was that hot, you know, I still would have been in Vegas and I was like, oh, like he, he's a little tougher than I think people think mentally. But yeah, I mean, I see the Saints take, they take that team very seriously to fans, so I could totally see them wanting their heads Dennis Allen's head, if that's the case. Um, a dark course for me. I know we didn't do dark course, but dark course for me would actually be Robicella and the Jets and if it goes, if it goes self quickly, you know.
Dave Clarke:
Aaron Rodgers has a history again fucking good coaches for that.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
Yeah, that go, that goes self quickly. You know, we can definitely get that that's a good call. That's a good call. My best seller is out of there, so, but, like I said, I'm going to say we're going to go over what Martin said, we're going to go with Dennis Allen, but dark course is definitely Robicella.
Dave Clarke:
So you guys picking that?
Rayshawn Buchanan:
is that is, that is that is, that is. That is that Okay.
Dave Clarke:
Um, lock that in. Uh, mike, you said bulls to me, which I think is a pretty decent call, considering it's the guy who presided over Tom Brady's worst ever career NFL season is only losing season is only losing season ever. I think that, uh, I think that constitutes some fire under his ass coming into this next season. He's not in a great position. He no longer has Tom Brady, so that's not not that you know.
Bob Kelly:
I'm here to talk you out of anything but like if they didn't fire balls after last year coming into this year, why would they do it at this point? Yeah, I guess I would. Be the advantage of that is my action.
Dave Clarke:
They needed a scapegoat coming into the season Like that's true.
Bob Kelly:
I mean, yeah, good point.
Michael Marcangelo:
You know, they can also say that that the reason that that team was so bad last year is because of injuries and what, what. What became most apparent to me throughout that year was that there just wasn't any discipline, and that was. I mean that happened a lot under Aaron.
Dave Clarke:
That seemed to be what was frustrating Brady the most is that, like they weren't doing things that he was doing right, which is like what the Patriots prided themselves on was like do your job, hit your route, like all that shit, and it's like it just didn't look like that last year at all.
Michael Marcangelo:
So, if the discipline is still as bad as it was last year and we predicted them to win like five games this year, I think it's going to be one of those situations where they could start out like two and eight and they they ride off a couple of wins at late. So I and I also think that the NFL has a tendency to to fire African-American Georgia in this fashion They'll, they'll, fire.
Bob Kelly:
You don't say yeah, they'll fire anybody else. So like there's any kind of record or track record to support that, yeah.
Michael Marcangelo:
I know it's hard to say I wish I wasn't addicted to their drug.
Dave Clarke:
So yeah, that's a. That's a really good call. I'm happy to go with that. I'm going to throw a couple of other names out at you, just so we talked about it. My first coach fired would, if I were up to me and I was in charge of firing any coach in the first like six weeks, it would be Josh McDaniels. I'd fire him today and try and get a new coach in there to you know coach only because he's like he's a myth, like his ability to coach a football team is a myth. But go ahead If we think Jimmy G is going to be healthy.
Michael Marcangelo:
Let's just say nine games in the first nine they're probably going to be like seven and two.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, but this is. But here's the thing. This is like the thing that Patriots fans have have been like talking themselves into for the last decade is like the Jimmy G Josh McDaniels connection and like what it's going to look like. But the fact of the matter is they have one of the best deep threats in the NFL on their team and the guy with the worst deep ball at starting quarterback on their team at the same time. So I just don't I, you know you can be Josh McDaniels and you can be this offensive guru that you've like claimed to be over the years. I don't see it. I've never seen it. I don't understand it. I think he may as a play color.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
He's fine. It's the head coach he's. He's terrible as a play. Color. He's fine as a play car.
Dave Clarke:
I guess he's fine. I mean, I think I've seen him make it. I've seen him do that thing where he thinks that he, his mega mind, is the thing that, like is going to solve every problem that comes up. And I think that he overthink situations and I think that when you're the head coach that's a little bit more apparent and that and the holes in the ship become, like, a little bit easier to see. I think that there was things about his play calling that then this is just my opinion that you've watched a lot more Patriots games than I have, a lot more closely than I have but I think that there's things about his play calling that are boggled my fucking mind over the years, to be honest with you. But yeah, I mean, a day to day play color is OK. This myth of, like Jimmy G and Josh McDaniels and the like, the check down fucking white guy offense that like they were always trying to run over the last 10 years, like I don't, I don't see it, but maybe. But yeah, I still think probably top bowls more likely, just because, like the NFL is racist as fuck. Ron Rivera is in a hot seat, who I think is actually a really good coach and I really like him. I'm a little biased because he was in my organization for a long time and he was really good, but he's definitely in a hot seat. Stefansky and the Browns pretty good. They're not going to, they're not going to blame, they're not going to blame their, their, their new franchise quarterback, before they blame their coach If things start going wrong. But I actually kind of think the Browns are going to be a little bit better than than everyone thinks. I think that they have like a little bit more of an offense than people are letting on. I think they have a really great edge rusher, which we just talked about and I think they're going to be OK. So I wouldn't say that. But since we've talked about it, I could really see Mike McCarthy getting fires. I know this is to be totally honest with you, I could really play it. All that fucking play calling, talk like the only hard pitch I'm going to make to you. I'm happy to go with bowls because I think that's probably correct, but I'll make a hard pitch of, like how funny would it be if McCarthy was the first coach fired and we were right? Like how funny would that be, like we could just sacrifice, so sold Right, fuck it, mccarthy.
Bob Kelly:
I hate you guys.
Dave Clarke:
Just like putting that point on the board.
Michael Marcangelo:
That also cuts. Also cuts us the fact that we think that they're going to go 11 and 6.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, Well, that's what that's called a hedge Mike.
Bob Kelly:
That's how you ever. That is betting 101. That is betting 101, my friend.
Dave Clarke:
Okay, the last thing to do is to call the coin toss for the Thursday night game to kick off the regular season, graciously. Even though I have an always coin toss call, I'm going to defer to you guys. Call it heads or tails.
Bob Kelly:
Ray, we know the call here, right, I always go ahead, you do.
Michael Marcangelo:
Oh no, that makes this so much better.
Dave Clarke:
Oh, no, okay, I'm going to cut you a 20 minute conversation about, like if you flip a coin 6,000 times 51% of the time.
Bob Kelly:
Hang on.
Rayshawn Buchanan:
But if you, if you want to go, tails never fails, they're cool, but I would go ahead.
Bob Kelly:
No, we're going to do this right now. Hang on, this is great radio. I'm going to do the Susan B.
Dave Clarke:
Anthony coin from back.
Bob Kelly:
I just did. I just did a Google coin toss simulator and it came up to us Two in a row Tails. It is.
Dave Clarke:
Two in a row. It's never going to be heads.
Bob Kelly:
That's just how probability works.
Dave Clarke:
Okay, you guys have tails, we have heads. We will be watching out for that in the in the start of the regular season. Don't forget to tune into missing the point over the course of the season, to track all these records as they go terribly off the fucking rails, to watch Mike McCarthy be the first head coach fired and to see how many points we get towards the end of the regular season so we can go into high stakes. Final jeopardy.
Bob Kelly:
You know how miserable the power ranking shows are going to be if Michael McCarthy is the first coach fired. You know how terrible the season would have to go if he's the first coach fired.
Dave Clarke:
Yeah, miserable for you, we're going to have a great time.
Bob Kelly:
Fun forever.
Dave Clarke:
But listen, it's been really fun. This has been the AFC NFC record prediction show at missing the point. Please feel free to to track our numbers, call us out on the socials for being dumb, follow the MVP race and our predictions there and definitely tune into the power ranking show which we will be bringing you every single week from the time that the NFL season kicks off until the playoffs. But for my teammate and Justin Fields aficionado and now new best friend, mike Marcangelo for the other team Whoever the fuck those guys are now Bob Kelly and Ray Sean Buchanan, hollywood Ray for those gents. For us, tails does never fail and I'm disappointed we didn't get that. But this has been missing the point.